Brian Cowen's legacy of failure as Taoiseach

[townman]

Brendan Maher is out for tipp for up to 3 or 4 months big blow to tipp he will miss the cork game in thurles
i suppose its Cowen fault as well who cares lads i think this site should be kept to the old Gaaa

[uibhfaillian]

Who did you vote for?? Interesting you wont tell us yet you seem really interested in who I voted for!

None of your business. We're talking about Lowry here because you volunteered to tell us that you would have voted for him. But if you really want to know who I vote for a quick scan through this thread will tell you, even a gobdaw like you should be able to figure that out.

Is this the same Fine Gael that had its debts magicaly dissapear during the nineties??

Yeah that's why it appears they are afraid to unequivocally call for Lowry to resign, Lowry would know a fair bit about how that debt magically disappeared.

NO he hasnt. A tribunal is not the same as a criminal trial, In a criminal trial the burden of proof is on the prossecutor and the case has to be proven beyond reasonable doubt, in a tribunal, there are submissions, statements and witness testimony which is then followed by the report issued from the Judge, this is not a report based on fact, it is some fact and then the judge's opinion based on the evidence presented. So where is the "smoking gun" sherlock??

Where's the smokin gun sherlock he says Everyone knows Lowry is corrupt - you even admit that he's corrupt yourself - he's just been smart enough to ensure the money went around in circuitous routes so as he could get away with it and you think he should be rewarded for that by voting for him.

Besides, every good politician has a bad side....there has always been "gombeen" politicians as you like to call them, Charlie Haughey started the IFSC, the single biggest wealth generating sector in this country and has been for the last 2 decades, he also was a "gombeen" politician. They have them in every single country in the world, Sure wasnt our own JFK a drug addicted womaniser?? How about his recently deceased brother Teddie..and the misterious dissapearence of a woman he socialised with on the night of her dissapearence?? How about Tony Blair & Maggie Thatcher and all their shady deals with Rupert Murdoch.

What has any of that got to do with Michael Lowry being corrupt.

Power corrupts its just a fact of life...get over it and stop talking crap about some rainbow politician whos going to make all our troubles go away. They dont exist and I will vote for a corrupt politician who has provided thousands of jobs in his constituency before I vote for others who promise the world but cant deliver a smooth road. Tell me who you voted for and we can discuss their morality??!

So because "power corrupts and is a fact of life" you're going to continue voting for known corrupt politicians?

Yes we are adults, but I dont remember abusing you??!!

Wah wah the redneck gombeen defender doesn't like being abused on the internet. As I said before it's a free country and you can vote for who you like, but at the end of the day Lowry is a corrupt gombeen bag of sh*t and people like you who support him are redneck backward idiots. If you find that abusive - tough get over it - ultimately it's people like you who are to blame for corrupt politicians like Lowry being put into positions of power where they swindle and rip off the people of this country. People like me and people like you. That's why - when it comes to voting for the corrupt gombeen Michael Lowry - you sir, are an idiot.

Did I put that nicely enough for you?

[uibhfaillian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxoTKDEDfAQ

Here's a sample of your average redneck, backward, Lowry voting, idiot that appeared on RTE Radio 1 this morning

[backofthenet]

Umm well its either Labour or Sinn Fein id guess, neither is exactly squeaky clean!

Everyone knows that lowry is corrupt...well im afraid even if that were true it still isnt good enough, Media Assasinations have happened for the last few hundred years, Charles Stewart Parnell comes to mind. If there was any wrongdoing im sure it will be proven, I will hold my tongue until then.

What has it to do with Lowry? I was just showing you how perspective is a two sided coin, JFK etc are celebrated people however they are not so loved in other countries. One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist. Maggie Thatcher was loved by the conservative upper middle class, whilst she was and is still detested in most working class area's.

Power does corrupt. Its a well knowing saying for a reason, and again I have to correct you, I didnt vote for Lowry, plus he is not a corrupt politician in my mind.

I can see youre one of those people who pretend they want a discussion by opening a thread in a forum, then when someone cares to show a difference of opinion you try to abuse them into your way of thinking. Now lets see, Ive expressed myself without using abuse, Ive made my points using examples and told you on more than one occasion to at least try to keep it civil. And Im the idiot I think we will leave the discussion there.

[uibhfaillian]

Umm well its either Labour or Sinn Fein id guess, neither is exactly squeaky clean!

Everyone knows that lowry is corrupt...well im afraid even if that were true it still isnt good enough, Media Assasinations have happened for the last few hundred years, Charles Stewart Parnell comes to mind. If there was any wrongdoing im sure it will be proven, I will hold my tongue until then.
What has it to do with Lowry? I was just showing you how perspective is a two sided coin, JFK etc are celebrated people however they are not so loved in other countries. One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist. Maggie Thatcher was loved by the conservative upper middle class, whilst she was and is still detested in most working class area's.

Now he's attempting to associate Lowry with Parnell having earlier spoken about the corrupt gombeen nobody Lowry in association with JFK and other heads of states. Give us a break will ya.

Power does corrupt. Its a well knowing saying for a reason, and again I have to correct you, I didnt vote for Lowry, plus he is not a corrupt politician in my mind.

Lowry is corrupt, you are lieing to yourself if your mind tells you anything different. Even though he might be good at getting credit for getting something done around your locality - which may have got done anyway - in a gombeen fashion, what you don't seem to get is that the likes of Lowry have had a corrosive affect on Irish politics. You don't seem to get it and you probably never will.

I can see youre one of those people who pretend they want a discussion by opening a thread in a forum, then when someone cares to show a difference of opinion you try to abuse them into your way of thinking. Now lets see, Ive expressed myself without using abuse, Ive made my points using examples and told you on more than one occasion to at least try to keep it civil. And Im the idiot I think we will leave the discussion there.

I'd agree with you on that one.

[uibhfaillian]

Umm well its either Labour or Sinn Fein id guess, neither is exactly squeaky clean!

Everyone knows that lowry is corrupt...well im afraid even if that were true it still isnt good enough, Media Assasinations have happened for the last few hundred years, Charles Stewart Parnell comes to mind. If there was any wrongdoing im sure it will be proven, I will hold my tongue until then.

What has it to do with Lowry? I was just showing you how perspective is a two sided coin, JFK etc are celebrated people however they are not so loved in other countries. One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist. Maggie Thatcher was loved by the conservative upper middle class, whilst she was and is still detested in most working class area's.

Power does corrupt. Its a well knowing saying for a reason, and again I have to correct you, I didnt vote for Lowry, plus he is not a corrupt politician in my mind.

I can see youre one of those people who pretend they want a discussion by opening a thread in a forum, then when someone cares to show a difference of opinion you try to abuse them into your way of thinking. Now lets see, Ive expressed myself without using abuse, Ive made my points using examples and told you on more than one occasion to at least try to keep it civil. And Im the idiot I think we will leave the discussion there.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news ... 97021.html

I presume you're from this neck of the woods that the article above is referring to, and that you'll get your head out of your ass and join with the other people of Moneygall in keeping the corrupt gombeen Lowry in his box when Obama comes to visit. It should be a happy day for Moneygall people, but seeing Lowry hanging around will put a dampener on things. If he had any class he'd stay away - some chance of that eh, Lowry having any class I mean.

[uibhfaillian]

I was thinking of this thread today when these 2 stories appeared in the media by coincidence.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0921/casino.html

I'm no fan of Fine Gael's Alan Shatter but I'm delighted this scam that the gombeen Lowry was involved with didn't get off the ground. The rednecks who voted for Lowry put all their chips on the wrong gombeen by the looks of it. Lowry is a beaten docket .

And then there was also a report on the RTE 9 o'clock News today concerning the white elephant FAS facility at Mount Lucas near Daingean - an old story but came up again today. It's a 7 million euro facility with 3 tutors and 4 students??? They were supposed to be teaching fellas about JCB's I think. The report is in this news programme:

http://www.rte.ie/player/#!v=1113505

[backofthenet]

I was thinking of this thread today when these 2 stories appeared in the media by coincidence.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0921/casino.html

I'm no fan of Fine Gael's Alan Shatter but I'm delighted this scam that the gombeen Lowry was involved with didn't get off the ground. The rednecks who voted for Lowry put all their chips on the wrong gombeen by the looks of it. Lowry is a beaten docket .

And then there was also a report on the RTE 9 o'clock News today concerning the white elephant FAS facility at Mount Lucas near Daingean - an old story but came up again today. It's a 7 million euro facility with 3 tutors and 4 students??? They were supposed to be teaching fellas about JCB's I think. The report is in this news programme:

http://www.rte.ie/player/#!v=1113505

I think the opinion is divided on the casino idea. The chance of creating potentially 2000 full time jobs let alone the construction jobs and spin off jobs that would be created were a big reason to go ahead with the project, allied to that the project is financed by a private individual backed by foreign banks so there was no financial risk. This project was also more than a casino, thurles has well known greyhound and horse racing venues which were going to be incorporated into the project, the current horse racing venue is very run down so the change would have been a big boost to the horse racing industry in the area.

I think there is a chance the project will still go ahead on a smaller scale. To be honest im not sure why the government is blocking this project, if a private individual wants to pump their money into this and abides by the planning and gambling rules then I cant see the problem.

On the second clip, I guess it shows there are more gombeen politicians around, and there far closer to home aswell

[Lone Shark]

I could put together a very solid business case for the nation's biggest brothel today and undoubtedly there would be employment in there. That doesn't mean that the right thing to do would be to railroad through legislation to make it happen.

The thing with this whole project is that like anything else in this country, you simply couldn't take the bank anything that was said by the developers in question. Of course Lowry's mere presence cast a pall over the whole thing, but aside from that, it's easy to see why people would be skeptical. They say the whole project would create 2000 long term jobs, if successful. However to say the project required no state cash intervention is wrong for a start - local infrastructure would have to be upgraded hugely to accommodate this. If there are 2000 full time jobs, there have to be 10,000 visitors every day. Even if we park for a moment the scale of that number, that means that there has to be the ability for 12,000 people to get in and out of this site every day, with all the attendant requirement for road development, rail upgrading, water and sewage capacity, additional pressure on Limerick Regional Hospital which is already at breaking point, and many more things. So the claim that there was "no cost to the state" is wrong to begin with.

Now you have the whole issue of what if the public plans and private plans are different? The casino was the big moneyspinner - so maybe the Hotel never happens, they just do a deal with other local hotels? Same with the golf course, and then other things are scaled down. Suddenly it just becomes a big casino with a few add ons, and not nearly the same scale of employment. There is no sanction in place to prevent this.

That's not to say that some cost wouldn't have been worthwhile, if there was a realistic chance of a viable, long term development that would wash it's own face. This is where we have to start questioning 10,000 visitors a day. Who are these people, where are they coming from, how are they getting here? That looks like an absurdly large number to me. They can only come from two sources - occasional visitors looking for a big blowout, which I find it hard to believe there would be enough of, and regular visitors, making a habit of coming in and spending €100 - €300 in a day. Socially, that could be problematic. Of course there are plenty of outlets for those with gambling addiction issues to whittle away their fortune whether it be small or large, but resorts like this make their money by being escapist. I've been to Las Vegas, and to say it's like another world understates it. You really lose touch with reality, and that's exactly how they want it.

The location itself, while it made perfect sense to those living in the locality with dollar signs in their eyes, did not hold water in the slightest. There are plenty of natural tourist resorts in Ireland, with easy access, where this would have made much more sense. I'm thinking a little bit outside Cork, where you have motorway from Dublin and an Airport, or possible Waterford for the same reasons. If this project did start bringing in people, flights would be added and existing infrastructure would be used, rather than new stuff being required. More relevantly, the project could be tied in with existing holiday attractions and thus you'd have more of a chance of getting people in. Ridiculous though it sounds, even Knock might make more sense for that very reason, though again they wouldn't be ready for that number of people on a daily basis. Or put it somewhere down near Limerick, and make it a potential stop for those on Shannon cruises as well as again, near an airport, rail line and motorway.

Finally, you have the danger of unintended consequences. If permission was granted for this project, and I choose to set up a smaller scale casino in Ferbane, it then becomes very hard to say no. If you let the project go a long way and then key people pull out, you end up with pressure on the state to step in and sort it out. If the project gets off the ground and people leave jobs in Dublin or Cork to come and work closer to home, maybe taking out mortgages on the strength of it, and it collapses six months in, you've done huge damage to a lot of lives.

As a member of the gambling industry keen to relocate to the midlands, this possibly would have been a great opportunity for me - but I'm still able to take a wider view, and see that this was an obvious decision for the state to take, and that the case against it was far, far bigger than just "a big boost to the area".

[backofthenet]

Il make a case for the defence for a laugh!

First off you cant compare a brothel to a casino, I understand the point youre trying to make but there is a massive difference

There would be minimal state cash needed. For a start the new M8 motorway runs within a mile of two mile borris, it is within a few miles of a rail connection at thurles which has a very big service to dublin with a fast train getting you from the capital to thurles in a hour. There would be some sewage and water upgrades but I think again this would be minimal.

On the issue of the public and private plans being different. The proposed developement has already signed notice of intentions to move with Thurles Racecourse, Greyhound track & golf club. So 3/6 elements are replacing old (racing track) and badly located (greyhound track right beside semple)(golf club crosses a major artery road into thurles) and are not recreating the wheel. The other 3 elements are the casino which you have agreed is the moneyspinner, the hotel which would be required in order for the casino to be in anyway successful and the music venue, which without any viable opposition could fill 15,000 seats once or twice a month provided it is capable of drawing in the acts.

Im not sure where the figure of 10,000 comes from, but a figure of 2000 - 3000 is more than achievable and would make the project viable. You have 250,000 visitors to Holycross Abbey, 500,000 come to the Rock Of Cashel, both attractions are within 10 miles of the proposed developement.

Add to this thurles greyhound track which draws between 500 - 1500 twice weekly, The racecourse draws 4000 - 5000 to the 11 or 12 track meets it holds annually. Add to this the potential of the music venue to draw visitors, semple stadium which draws 50,000 a couple of times a year along with a lot of club, league, under 21 and minor intercounty games which can draw up to 10 or 20,000 depending on the game.

The location rather than being a downside, it is an advantage
- There are 3 international airports within 2 hours of the venue
- It is located on the main motorways between dublin, cork, limerick
- It has major visitor attractions in the area to feed off of
- It is about 1 hr from Limerick, 1 1/2 hours from Cork & 2 hours from Dublin
- The Land, construction and employment costs should save about 30 - 40% making it far more feasable.

Finally on unintended consequences. This is where your argument really starts to fall apart. The funding for the project is in place. The construction phase will involve the employment of 1000 construction jobs for three years. After that phase the plan is to have 1000 - 2000 full time jobs.

So bearing in mind that there are nearly half a million people on the dole in Ireland. How many of the 2000 jobs will go to people who are currently employed in dublin or limerick?? Il give you a an optimistic 10%, now how many of that 10% do you honestly believe will move to thurles, apply and get a mortage within the first 6 months of the project?? I think you could count them on your hands and toes!!

[Lone Shark]

Excellent rebuttal, and a much better explanation than we've seen from any of the official spokespersons for the project so far. I still don't necessarily agree, but there are some good points in there. Anyway, here's my counterpoints:

First off you cant compare a brothel to a casino, I understand the point youre trying to make but there is a massive difference

I've been in Las Vegas and I've seen proper casinos in action - increased oxygen levels and the complete absence of clocks to make you lose track of time, laid out so as to almost obscure the exits, they are a different world entirely to the tiny little things we have over here. There is a social question here, and one about which we need to make a conscious decision. Personally I actually would be happy to allow a casino like this in principle, but we should be examining the principle here, not justifying it on the grounds that casinos already exist.

There would be minimal state cash needed. For a start the new M8 motorway runs within a mile of two mile borris, it is within a few miles of a rail connection at thurles which has a very big service to dublin with a fast train getting you from the capital to thurles in a hour. There would be some sewage and water upgrades but I think again this would be minimal.

I don't know a lot about the Thurles Rail line but I do know that Irish rail is already full to capacity on a lot of routes at peak times, and there simply isn't the ability to accommodate more people coming in from the Dublin side, unless they all choose to travel at lunchtime. The Motorway would require a new exit and a new spur road, which my understanding was not part of the budget for the enterprise itself? I'm open to correction here though.

I don'[t know that I'd agree about water and sewage upgrades being minimal though. I live in an area (Knocknacarra, Galway) where the water infrastructure isn't able for the population and it's not nice to say the least, there are huge inconveniences regularly. I've also seen the council debates about the cost of upgrading and it's anything but minimal.

Im not sure where the figure of 10,000 comes from, but a figure of 2000 - 3000 is more than achievable and would make the project viable. You have 250,000 visitors to Holycross Abbey, 500,000 come to the Rock Of Cashel, both attractions are within 10 miles of the proposed developement.

Right, for the numbers bit:

I've heard a few numbers for the total cost of the project -http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingne ... 21412.html quotes 460m. So if we say 400m, then you have a capital servicing cost of €20m per annum, based on 5% a year - and even 5% a year is very low for a project like this. 2000 full time staff at an average wage of €30k (cost to the employer €35k in PRSI and benefits) is another €70m, and then you'll have other non-personnel costs on top of that, which is often as much as 50% of payroll in projects like this, leaving €125m per annum to be found. That's approximately €350,000 gross profit per day. Unless people are bringing an average of €120 in gambling money alone, then you need a lot more than 3,000 visitors. Bear in mind here that bars/restaurants/shops will make money, but I haven't allowed for a cost of sales in there, so the end revenue to the overall project will be minimal from these spinoffs. Equally the music venue will do okay after promoters and artists are paid, but it's not remotely the case that if I spend €200 at the venue, that's €200 profit. If I lose €200 at the casino fair enough, but hence my concern that the casino will get built at all costs, but not so the other aspects.

That's why I think 7000-8000 visitors minimum would be needed per day and I don't see where that number of people will come from. Your visiting Americans, Continental Europeans and Japanese will all go to see the Rock of Cashel and/or Holycross Abbey, but these are cheap excursions and unique to Ireland. You can go to a casino anywhere.




Finally,in terms of the jobs, I'm merely saying that dangling the prospect of long term work in front of somebody when the numbers simply don't seem to add up is not a good thing, particularly when some people will relocate. I'm not saying the human cost will be extensive, but it will exist, and with no realistic chance of success that I can see, there is no good reason to proceed.

[backofthenet]

On the social principle I dont even know where I stand there are plenty of arguments for and against and to be honest I dont want to get into that side too much Id rather leave that to people with far better skills than me!

Thurles is on the main rail line between Dublin - Cork, there is an hourly service from Dublin sometimes with thurles as the first and only stop from about 50% of them. The station has been upgraded in the last number of years. There would be a large amount of traffic on the train but having travelled at peak times on this route, it is always to the main feeder towns into dublin so that by the time the train hits portlaoise its about half empty having been packed in heuston. Irish Rail are also in the middle of expanding their fleet and are planning on adding 57 carriges to allow for further capacity and these are being delivered over the next year and the Dublin Cork line is the most lucrative id imagine a large percentage will be allocated there. Irish Rail have commited to having an hourly service from 6am - 10pm previously.

Taking your figures of 400 million, Mr Quirke that is backing the project already owns some of the propoesed land, he has already spent 30m on the design and planning process of the project and has substantial holdings in Dublin. I would estimate that rather than the proposed 460 million touted in 2009 you could take about 100m off the cost with land prices going to as low as 7k per acre in the thurles area, allied to the massive reductions in employment and other construction related costs.

So on my calculations you would be looking at a figure closer to 300m. That results in a servicing of 15m per annum. I would also argue the 2000 full time jobs are first of all optimistic, secondly they are including spin off jobs. So I would say approx half that figure would be directly employed by the project resulting in a cost of 35m. So I would estimate you would need about 80m or so to "stand still" resulting in a gross profit of 220k or a net spend of €73 per head based on 3000 visitors per day. This would mean visitor numbers of just over 1 million which is not far off other tourist attractions.

You are trying to get an average spend, but the reality is that the casino is based on "high rollers", a medium level of "blowouts" and then the novelty visitors. the high rollers are people who spend hundreds of thousands within hours in las vegas etc. I know these wont be coming in every day, but they are out there and with the multinational culture in Ireland its not unrealistic to expect to attract 1 or 2 high rollers per month spending hundreds of thousands of euro and bringing down the net spend required by the other 2-3k visitors.

Secondly youre scenario stating that americans etc wouldnt be interested in a casino is false in my book. The overwhelming reason why americans in particular love ireland is because of the people and when asked where they experience this it is always the local pub, the social interaction is what they crave most of all, and the casino can play into this. It could also become a destination of choice for stag and hen dos who currently populate temple bar and other areas.

There are also any amount of opportunitys open to the developement, Aidan OBrein saw it as an opportunity to hold a breeders cup event at the venue drawing in thousands upon thousands of spectators. Anyone that is familar with cheltenham knows that big horse racing events lead to big card games with some traveling simply for the card games!!

[Lone Shark]

Again, solid reply. Just to come back a second time:

(1) If trains are already full to capacity at Heuston, which is what I thought, it's not much good to people coming into Dublin Airport to tell them that there will be a seat from Portlaoise onwards. Irish Rail can make all the commitments it likes, but nothing will be funded in this country for the foreseeable future. We have to judge capacity on how things are now, and I would suggest that the infrastructure is not ready now. If part of Mr Quirke's plan is to help fund the purchase of more carriages exclusively for this line, then that's fair enough, but I've never heard mention of that.

(2) Money that has already been spent on land still has to be serviced, whether the purchase is completed or not. Equally I was allowing for a reduction when going from 460m down to 400m. Even at that I'm assuming that the whole project will be built to schedule, which is far from certain.

(3) On the whole jobs issue, that answer makes me skeptical. Either they will be generated, or they won't. If they will be generated and sustained, ultimately that money has to come from people spending money at the venue, even if it goes through the books a couple of times. That doesn't change whether they are primary employees or "spin off" jobs. If I'm a drinks wholesaler in the region, yes I might need more staff to deal with the upturn in business, but it goes back to my point about ultimately the paying punter has to put his hand in his pocket for the amount required. I don't think that kind of revenue is feasible.

However if the 2000 jobs is an "optimistic estimate" then essentially what you're saying is that the promoters of this project have put a big number out there to make the thing sound better - which is downright lying and raises several red flags. Say the number of jobs that will be created and we can judge on that basis, don't pick a big number to get it in the door and then ignore the promise. How could we trust anything they say if that's the way they do business?

(4) Having worked in the betting industry all my adult life, I know there are high rollers, but they aren't as plentiful as they are in other places, or as some people would believe. Most of them were the construction industry types and I can tell you now that those people have disappeared off the radar entirely. It's no coincidence that Ireland's most successful bookmaking chain, Paddy Power, is geared towards getting the €10 and €20 punter in the door, and all their offers are with that gambler in mind. Secondly, Irish high rollers tend to be more clued in than the American or Asian variety. I know in casino the game is what it is and there can never be an "edge" for the player the same way there could be in laying bets on the 2.30 from Gowran Park, but I wouldn't expect a significant amount of guys dropping large sums. There will be some, but if the business plan allows for a significant share of revenue from them, then it's flawed in my opinion.

(5) Tourists to Ireland tend to complain about how expensive it is, so a trip to a casino where everything will be overpriced won't change that. Secondly, the atmosphere in the Irish pub is entirely different to the atmosphere in a casino - as I said, they can have that back home. Casinos are not really social scenes, except for perhaps the poker tables.

(6) I'd love to see such events coming to Ireland, and you are right about the card playing action that will be generated. Nonetheless those events are often loss leaders until they become established, and existing racecourses aren't going to give up their leading fixtures to send them down to Thurles. Secondly, you can have big money flat events all you like that may bring in some international tourism, but the Irish public is still a national hunt audience in the main, so it will be difficult to cater for both groups. All that said I do agree that they would have to go down this road if the venue is to survive.

[Bord na Mona man]

While I'm all for ambition and jobs creation, I just can't see this working on the scale proposed.
Big city attractions like Euro Disney in Paris and the Millennium Dome in London struggled to get the numbers in when they opened, with the latter finishing up as a loss making flop.

I feel sometimes these grand ambitious proposals are actually a cover for something else, or just an old fashioned publicity stunt. Perhaps Dr Quirkey will settle for being allowed to open a chain of smaller casinos around the country to make up for not getting this one?

If it was built and flopped, I still suspect we'd all up indirectly paying for it somehow.
I don't remember the taxpayer ever being asked to go guarantor on the billions in loans that property developers took out. Yet we got stung with the tab.

[uibhfaillian]

I'll be voting for Michael D Higgins tomorrow myself. I'm not going to tell people who to vote for, but I urge voters of all hues to steer away from Cowens bagman - the z-list celebrity FFer Sean Gallagher.

The Presidency is not a pivotal role in the large scheme of things, however it would be a backward step to elect Gallagher as President. Martin McGuinness may well have done the country some service when he exposed the bagman on RTE on Monday night. Vote for who you like, steer away from the bagman is all I'll say.