All Ireland Club Hurling Championship 2012-2013

[midfield63]

as a kk person,i think loan shark u were right at d time to put them at no2 in the county,coolderry were in d previous all ireland and we were not at dat time. as for d match kk were awsome,power passion and stamina but dat was what we expected,but i thought der stick work and skill has been getting better in every game they have played

[Lone Shark]

Lone Shark wrote:
I note that there are plenty of people queuing up to talk big and give out to me over the piece, but I can also confirm that there hasn't been a red cent of money for second favourites K-K for next year's championship.Just as it was yesterday - everyone talked about the 5/1 price, but unless things changed in the morning, nobody was actually betting on it. And coming from a betting background, I've learned that talk is cheap but the movement of money is the real indicator of the truth.

I've commented on this before, but just to reiterate; I don't believe that just because someone hasn't spent money that they are not entitled to their opinion. Maybe in the gambling/commerce world, spending money is the only 'truth' but for a lot of people they can form an opinion and communicate that belief without having to gamble money to legitimate their point of view.

Also, getting abuse is never nice. Don't let a couple of people telling you that you are not welcome to celebrate in KK speak for everyone. If it is something that you want to do, then you have as much entitlement to be there as the person telling you that you are not welcome. In writing your rankings of teams, you knew it was going to be read and in placing the first time county champions as number 2, you knew it was going to cause debate and get some people worked up. Writing a public column where you are expressing your opinion is not going to make you popular with everyone, so there is not much point in taking umbrage with the few that pull you up on it in a way that you don't like.

That are there lads out there who would never dream of betting but who would be extremely astute when it comes to hurling or football is something I don't doubt, and when it comes to the rankings thing, of course there will be different opinions. Complete agreement with you there. The abuse side doesn't bother me that much and at this stage, I'm not about to change my style. So I say to all readers out there that if I haven't managed to inadvertently insult your club yet, I probably will soon, so sit tight.

However if you're the type of person who knows the odds of an event before it happens and you have an idea how odds work, then yes, I am skeptical if you get on a high horse but don't put money down. I'm not talking about guys who've never walked into a betting shop here - I'm talking about all the folk that were broadcasting loud and clear about how 5/1 was available from Powers, 11/2 and 6/1 from independents, they knew that it was a six point handicap and they knew that Thurles were no bigger than 1/5 anywhere. If those odds were genuinely incorrect, then people who do frequent betting shops - and that's a lot of people in this country - would have taken them.

I probably did over-react to some of the responses I got, but I revised my view very publicly after the Oulart match and I'm just tired of everyone ignoring that revision, as if my view in November is what I will think from now until the Second Coming. Secondly, it was put across to me by several people that I was somewhere between don't-let-him-near-sharp-objects crazy and thick as a ditch for holding that view, even though Ireland's biggest bookmakers thought the same thing. Disagree with me by all means, but give me some credit for at least putting some thought into what I did rather than assuming I'm not to be trusted on my own with a box of matches and a newspaper in case I'll burn the house down, such is my stupidity.

I will stop now - this is an un-necessary sideshow which is of no relevance to the big picture, which is the incredible achievements of Kilcormac-Killoughey.

And they're even setting fashion trends in the process it seems. http://balls.ie/gaa/are-these-kilcormac ... t-balding/

[KillougheyGoBragh]

Fantastic match which kept everyone on the edge of their seat for the best part of the sixty or so minutes.
A big thank you, to both teams, for entertainment presented by amateur sportspeople in a near professional manner.
O'Moore Park was in great condition given the biblical floods we have in recent weeks.
The hurling was of pretty high standard given the damp conditions and the enormity of the occasion.
Officials were efficient but again the players from both sides made it easy to officiate.
Supporters were phenomenal on the K-K side especially when our only substitution was made and Brian Leonard was given a near standing ovation as he walked back to the subs-bench. He looked taken aback by the appreciation rightly shown to him.

[llkj]

I always find it interesting to see how many times 'the bookies' and 'the media/newspapers' are quoted in pre and post match interviews. Pre-match it is always - 'bookies/newspapers have no influence whatsoever, 2 teams going out, bla bla' and then afterwards 'to see the way we were written off in the papers and the fact that the bookies had us at n/1...'
In truth, these things are mentioned beforehand within a dressing room and probably just come out in an interview afterwards by a player... but i don't really think they form the backbone of a team's motivation.

Seeing as LS mentioned 'sideshows' - how about Lar Corbett. I was amazed to find out that he was on the trip to the US recently with other GAA 'celebs' to help out in the recovery process in Breezy Point. Sends out the wrong message to teammates - I'm heading off for a week, you boys stay at home and run around the fields that horses shouldn't be on. If I was manager, I'd flat out tell him not to go and do it publicly in front of the rest of the team.
I would rate him as a good intercounty forward, who can have some exceptional moments, but definitely not the 'superstar' that his media efforts over the last few years have tried to make him out to be. It is pretty clear, that he made a conscious effort to raise his profile. Do GAA players have PR companies that assist with that or is that through the GPA or just individual efforts?

Also, one other thing the club series brings to light is that hurling does have a place outside of intercounty and Croke Park during the Summer. Some of the greatest games of the modern era have been in the club championships, yet still they are mainly an afterthought in sports news shows. The club championship's, in my mind, are the most difficult prize to win in team sports in this country, when you consider the amount of clubs that are competing for that one prize.

[Plain of the Herbs]

I watched the first 60 minutes of St Thomas’s v Loughgiel last night. A few observations –

The Kilcormac-Killoughey v Thurles Blues match had the better quality hurling.

St Thomas’ have huge difficulty effecting a correct tackle. That was the reason for the huge imbalance in the ‘frees awarded’ statistic. Naturally, being Galway, they are blaming the referee. The reality is that either they were never coached how to tackle or just ignored what they were told.

Barry Kelly had a decent game, despite much criticism from the west. Still, he twice stopped DD Quinn taking quick puckouts and gave the goalkeeper a yellow card the second time. Both those puckouts followed wides so it wasn’t as if Kelly was still marking a score. And the umpire drawing the referee’s attention to a foul during play is contrary to rule.

St Thomas’s have a number of fine forwards who would revel in Croke Park should they qualify. Conor Cooney, Richie Murray and James Regan would all do well in space on a good pitch. The stocky fella of the Burkes (corner forward) is quick too. And they could have grabbed a late winner.

Of the Loughgiel forwards, only Eddie McCloskey really showed. McCarry and Joey Scullion did betimes. Still, their their angled running in support of the ball-carrier is lovely to watch.

Watson did his usual, playing dead, pretending to be injured. Then recovering without actually receiving any medical attention other that a few soothing words from the medical personnel.

The replay is fixed for 5.45pm on Saturday evening, so Kilcormac will get a good look at both teams.

The Parnell Park pitch was in an awful state. And it’s not going to get any better before Offaly go there in a fortnight.

The extraordinarily long break between normal time and extra time means I ran out of disc time with five minutes to go at the end of extra time

[durra1]

Few points:-

Absolutely raging I missed it but the Russell / Leahy combo is working well on for the KK games on M103. The former was sharper on Saturday, probably due to the commentators comfort with the KK panel and the latter providing the in-depth insight.

Thrilled and over the moon for KK and what they have achieved. Congrats to you KgB – must be great to come back to occasions like this as an exile. A fantastic template for any sports team who is dealing with the residue of shortcomings on the big day. As I’ve said previously, I believe the goodwill of the county is really behind KK more than ever before.

I know its winter hurling and horses for courses for the county side in high summer but there’s an argument for building a spine of the county side around the feel good factor of KK – god knows we need a bit of dog in our second half performances.

A new Pope and a KK AIHC title on Paddy’s day? Who would have thought?!

LS – a bit of open advice, if you are in any way stung by criticism and if you find yourself engaging detractors on an online forum, in my view you could be in the wrong game.

A tipster in the public eye such as yourself will get plenty of calls wrong in a career and your balls need to be hard enough to take whatever comes back at you - however strongly that is expressed . Any seasoned and reasoned punter who follows you into a bet does so with the usual caveats attached – the main ones being that nobody believes you are :-

1. God/ Allah / Buddah etc.
2. Mystic Meg with a bandana and tarot cards.
3. The Maharishi Mahesh Yogi from India.
4. Nostradamus.
5. Michael Gallagher the postman in Donegal.
6. Paul the Octopus (RIP).

LLKJ is right to take you up on your reliance on talking up the fluctuation of betting odds in the run up to a fixture.

Talking generally here, and not at all wishing to direct this at you LS - these days, there’s an omnipresence of PR-driven spin sponsored by the vested interests in the gambling industry.

You hear TV ‘personalities’ name-checking a branded bookmaker with odds-talk in the run up to a game and you ask yourself - did he just happen to read those odds online on his smartphone on the way to the studio that morning or did he get slipped a monkey (to use industry terminology) by a PR bunny to impart the gospel according to the gambling industry to the masses?

Some of the most informed sporting people I know won’t wager more than a fiver at any time … with very good reason.

Also agree with you LLKJ about Lar in NY. Thought the same actually when Gerry Cooney went to Africa at the start of last year’s league. However well intended the cause, the focus these days must be total.

[kingscounty]

Few points:-

Absolutely raging I missed it but the Russell / Leahy combo is working well on for the KK games on M103. The former was sharper on Saturday, probably due to the commentators comfort with the KK panel and the latter providing the in-depth insight.

Thrilled and over the moon for KK and what they have achieved. Congrats to you KgB – must be great to come back to occasions like this as an exile. A fantastic template for any sports team who is dealing with the residue of shortcomings on the big day. As I’ve said previously, I believe the goodwill of the county is really behind KK more than ever before.

I know its winter hurling and horses for courses for the county side in high summer but there’s an argument for building a spine of the county side around the feel good factor of KK – god knows we need a bit of dog in our second half performances.

A new Pope and a KK AIHC title on Paddy’s day? Who would have thought?!

LS – a bit of open advice, if you are in any way stung by criticism and if you find yourself engaging detractors on an online forum, in my view you could be in the wrong game.

A tipster in the public eye such as yourself will get plenty of calls wrong in a career and your balls need to be hard enough to take whatever comes back at you - however strongly that is expressed . Any seasoned and reasoned punter who follows you into a bet does so with the usual caveats attached – the main ones being that nobody believes you are :-

1. God/ Allah / Buddah etc.
2. Mystic Meg with a bandana and tarot cards.
3. The Maharishi Mahesh Yogi from India.
4. Nostradamus.
5. Michael Gallagher the postman in Donegal.
6. Paul the Octopus (RIP).

LLKJ is right to take you up on your reliance on talking up the fluctuation of betting odds in the run up to a fixture.

Talking generally here, and not at all wishing to direct this at you LS - these days, there’s an omnipresence of PR-driven spin sponsored by the vested interests in the gambling industry.

You hear TV ‘personalities’ name-checking a branded bookmaker with odds-talk in the run up to a game and you ask yourself - did he just happen to read those odds online on his smartphone on the way to the studio that morning or did he get slipped a monkey (to use industry terminology) by a PR bunny to impart the gospel according to the gambling industry to the masses?

Some of the most informed sporting people I know won’t wager more than a fiver at any time … with very good reason.

Also agree with you LLKJ about Lar in NY. Thought the same actually when Gerry Cooney went to Africa at the start of last year’s league. However well intended the cause, the focus these days must be total.

Good post. Also Paul the Octopus what a legend, rip indeed.

[puzzled]

so you are saying K/K might as well stay at home that they won't be at the races
hope they don't have your faith

Just giving my honest opinion on what I think could happen I hope that i'm wrong.
I notice that while you are having a pop at my opinion you are not making any predictions yourself?

Best of luck to K/K on saturday!

well what did i tell you [/quote]
Well What did you tell me?
No balls to make any prediction yourself!
Totally delighted to be proved so wrong,what a great occasion to attend.
Fair play to all concerned and roll on Paddys day!

[Plain of the Herbs]

Kevin Grogan is some man to be playing Senior hurling for 18 years now, and he only 26! See this week's Tribune.

"I'm a very proud man. Im 18 years playing senior hurling but today's performance caps them all and by god am I looking forward to Croke Park. It doesn't get any easier especially with age. I won't be giving it up now. You just couldn't. Hopefully I will retire with a bang in Croke Park on St Patricks Day".

http://www.midlandtribune.ie/articles/s ... w-heights/


Oops! I presume they mean Kevin Rigney, who has been around for a bit longer than Kevin Grogan. Rigney won Minor hurling Finals hurling at full-back in both 1994 & 1995.

[durra1]

I see Currams and Slevin refer to the pre-match psychology around the 5-1 odds.

That kind of rubbish's my point around the importance of pre match betting stats!

[KillougheyGoBragh]

Yes, Kevin Rigney, as can be heard in his post-match interview with John Leahy along with Connor Mahon.
Stalwart Rigney hails from a family so steeped in GAA history he needs little or no introduction.
Interview 1

[westender]

Well done KK,
Great exhibition of team work, every one working for each other,Hungrier team won.
Young Geraghty's definately addd something new to KK this year.
Bring on Loughgiel Shamrocks, would rather play them than a young Galway side on the open pitch in croker.???

[Toxicity234]

Is see Jimmy Doyle having a go at Lar Corbett,


http://www.hoganstand.com/Tipperary/Art ... ?ID=185590

Tipperary hurling legend Jimmy Doyle fears that Lar Corbett hasn't learnt his lesson from his 'ridiculous' display in last year's All-Ireland SFC semi-final defeat to Kilkenny.

The six-time All-Ireland winner, a Thurles Sarsfields clubmate of Corbett, was embarrassed by the tactic of Lar following Tommy Walsh and says he saw more of the same in last Sunday's All-Ireland Club SHC semi-final defeat to Kilcormac-Killoughey.

"I think it was ridiculous," Doyle said to The Irish Examiner referring back to the Kilkenny game. "We're forwards, we never follow a back - a back follows you. I couldn't understand what Lar was at.

"He was there again last Saturday running around the field with no ball. I don't know what's going on, I can't understand his behaviour or what he's doing. He'd want to cop himself on.

"You run after the ball, you go for the ball, you get the ball and you use it. I think myself they're taking too much out of the ball. Let the ball do the work. They're killing themselves for nothing.

"You get rid of your ball, throw it in the right places at the right time and throw it out into the open spaces and go after it."

[Plain of the Herbs]

Apparently the replay of the other semi-final is now in Clones at 2 bells on Sahirday. K-K doing their own 'lesser spotted Ulster'.

[Plain of the Herbs]

The Lar Corbett bashing, based on one episode last August, is getting a bit tiresome at this stage.

Yes, Corbett has his limitations, being extremely one-sided, and K-K gained a mahoosive amount of energy from Conor Mahon’s early hook as Corbett attempted to strike the ball off his weak side.

Today, Jimmy Doyle says you throw the ball into the open spaces. Which you do. But the good hurler will aim to be in those open spaces anticipating the ball. If people are going to criticise a player for making a run (which isn’t picked out with a delivery) than that’s a cheap shot. Yes, Corbett would have been more dangerous close to goal, but remember he drove two brilliant pin-point balls into the danger area in the second half, one Richie Ruth flicked on that was blocked by the goalkeeper and another was arrowed in about 6’ off the ground late in the game. That Richie Ruth one may well have turned the game around, had it gone in. Inches.

“Don’t start a row but don’t walk away from one either” was a mantra quoted several times by Justin McCarthy in his book Hooked. At the first sign of niggle from Kevin Grogan, Corbett crossed the field, first to right half-forward, then to right corner, before coming rejoining Grogan a minute later. I thought that Corbett walked away from a row here. Corbett was never going to hurl on the right side of the pitch (because he can’t) and this cameo was another little boost for K-K and for Kevin Grogan in particular.

As for August, I wasn’t there that day so I only know what was on television. Anyway, it is reported that Henry Shefflin was glued to the Hogan Stand sideline, accompanied by Pádraic Maher, at the time Eddie Brennan breezed down the vacant centre of the Tipperary defence to set up Richie Hogan’s goal. Of course that was a work of genius. Because it worked.

Tipperary’s principle failing that August Sunday was that they failed miserably to utilise the spaces in their attack resulting from a pair of forwards and a pair of defenders effectively being decommissioned. Placing the Lorrha Maher at full-forward was a brain-fart on the part of management, and he terrorising Munster defences from centre half-forward earlier in the year.

I’m actually surprised at Jimmy Doyle criticising his neighbour of his in that manner. Tipperary are a strange people.

The attention being placed on Lar Corbett here is actually exonerating the likes of Michael Cahill from blame. At this stage of the club championship (well. any stage, really) required your leaders to stand up and lead. Cahill never hit a ball. It's actually difficult to believe the lad is a countyman.