DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
Fairplayalways
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Fairplayalways »

exactly, on what basis can anyone say "we will hammer Carlow"...not a chance of it..we will huff, puff, hand pass here and there, recycle the ball blah blah...Radio 3 cover the commentary as it is..poor.....Maughan I think has reached the end of the road, his post match interviews are all glass half full stuff, when infact the glass is as good as empty...the Division 3 tables tells no lies tonight when you look at it..we are third from bottom with the two worst teams, and not way worse than Offaly, just one loss more each, thats not much to write home about..

The Ferbane thing I suppose is abit strange, when you go through the team, its hard to see any Ferbane player nailing a place on the starting 15, on the panel yes maybe but starting 15??..if lads are opting for hurling there is no point discussing them...Cian Johnson is injured, fair enough, but whats this about him not being at that "pitch yet"...apart from injury, where better to cut your teeth in Division 3, its not as if you will be up against top quality defenders day in day out..I dont buy this oul lark about lads not ready for senior intercounty, look at Clifford for Kerry, dont start saying he is totally differnt, he is Kerry new prodigy, Cian Johnson is Offalys, when he gets over his injury, lets be having ya...like managers, players come and go, and players can drop off the scene very very quickly..The O'Malley/Maher thing I said before, If Maher doesnt go in because of O'Malleys presence, leave him where he is, the management is the mangement, he either respects that or not. Maughan can lay a similar line with O'malley if the likes of Maher did come back, as in "what went on before is outside this set up" etc. etc.

Our starting team is baffling, needing to win last 2 games to have any chance of promotion, yet two best forwards on the bench...even getting them on the field in the second half (15 minutes in in some cases) seems like the world has frozen and the players go in with a slowness almost as if it they know in their hearts it isnt going to make any difference...the substitutions are almost "will we wont we" type scenario...

Will we beat Carlow, I think we just might, maybe 0-12 to 0-11 if we are having a reasonable good day, if not it could be lower scores which speaks for itself...anyway, after that, next game is Kildare, it will be the end of the road I think..interesting to see where we go then Managerial wise...

pigeon house biffo
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by pigeon house biffo »

I think the reality is with teams like Cavan and Fermanagh coming down, Derry Tipp and Longford staying in with us, and a decent enough looking wicklow team coming up to div 3, its getting harder each year to be the third worst team in the league. Next year could well be the year we go down and then your looking at a situation where you have a couple of lads the wrong side of 30, the retirements start coming and then your stuck in the quagmire of division 4. I'm not saying this is what will happen or what I'd like to see happen, but its getting a real possibility. You look at the way promotion and relegatons tend to work, to my mind the best example are laois and i think maybe one or two others, possibly westmeath. You start out as a lower end div 1 or div 2 team and then the relegations come fast in quick succession and next thing your in div 4 before bouncing back up. Offalys position is arguably worse. We just do enough every year to stay where we are, never threatening to go up but always flirting with the possibility of going down. Its a terrible waste of the talent that we have, and we do have talent. Look we can talk about moral performances and victories, but at the end of the day you have to go out to win games. We'll face into next years league and teams will be looking at us 'Well what have offaly done in the league the last couple of years, not beaten and teams that have come down from div 2, beating the two teams bound for relegation and probably hit and a miss against the rest'. teams have us figured out before we start and i don't think any teams but the weakest fear us. That is where this frustration stems from. Two games in the league with realistically nothing to play for. Maughan himself said today that defensive football won't win anything yet we proceed to put in a woeful offensive display, leaving some of our best attacking talent out. If offaly went out and had a cut, a real cut at derry and tipp we could be sitting here maybe 1 point better off if not 4. Results could have also been the same and we could have lost both games as it eventually transpired but at least we showed some impetus and opponents next year will look at us and say these lads are worthy of a bit of respect. As it is we concede too much and score too sporadically and at random to be a real threat.

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mynamesjeff
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by mynamesjeff »

Tmacmahon wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:22 pm Has not improved us one bit, I completely agree in that he sounds terrific in front of a mic or a camera.
We have simply not progressed.

The Ferbane thing is scandalous.

His reluctance to pick his best team and indeed panel is not acceptable.

I would hope a change in management very soon , even if it’s because of financial strains the CB will have going forward.

We will hammer Carlow next week then loose to Kildare .
Please do tell of all these players that should be playing.
I’ve read enough delusional BS about this nonsense on social media. Read my bit above. Or below, as I have quoted. Funnily enough I know a few Ferbane people who would rubbish what you’re suggesting. You’d swear that Maughan has a vendetta again them. 2 lads are with the hurlers, one lad for a couple of reasons won’t be asked in. Another was (and arguably should be) on the panel, while they’ve 2 panelists. Please indicate the plethora of names that Maughan won’t ring to ask in. I know Ferbane players (well, might I add) who would laugh at your suggestion, which just highlights its absurdity. In fact, they’d suggest it to be somewhat of a conspiracy theory.
mynamesjeff wrote: Sun Oct 25, 2020 10:55 pm [quote=biffinbanner post_id=61227 time=<a href="tel:1603658943">1603658943</a> user_id=11652]
very strange to see no player from ferbane featuring on the starting team today or last week? 2019 winners 2018 finalists and beaten on penos this year in semi? i dont like maughans style. hes great in interviews and talks a good game but i dont think hes advancing offaly football the way hes setting up.
I agree on the latter bit.

On the Ferbane thing,
Cian Johnson is injured.
Joe Maher won’t be involved between the fact that he wouldn’t commit before Christmas one year, the bit where himself and O’Malley don’t get on and his two page spread in the Tribune about where he said he wasn’t asked in. Which wasn’t well received by a lot of people.
Oisín Kelly is with the hurlers.
Leon Fox is with the hurlers.
Jack Cullinan should arguably be in the shakeup for a place on the panel, but then again, he was on it at the start of the year.
Shane Nally is on the panel.

Who else from Ferbane should be involved? Being honest, nobody stands out, and at that, I wouldn’t necessarily have all those mentioned above on the panel. They’re just those already involved or the better footballers that Ferbane have.
[/quote]

Tmacmahon
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Tmacmahon »

The Ferbane Thing for me is simple

Jack Should be in there on the panel . Brilliant young GK. needs to be nurtured and given confidence by management. Has a Brilliant attitude And wants to get better and learn

The way Maughan has treated ( game time When fit) and referred to Cian in interviews is like he is constantly putting him in his place . This is a prodigious talent who is a lethal finisher and he has a reputation so it seems Maughan wants to show who’s boss. That is just my opinion.

Joe Maher Because he Had a falling out with a selector and or didn’t commit because of studies last year is being completely over looked in a somewhat petty display of management in my opinion.

Leon fox was asked in initially then could not attend the first session and was told no it’s ok.

That’s more than enough.


Nigel Dunne is Cleary better than all six starting forwards without any debate in my opinion. He’s not there , he left the panel because and this is from a player on the panel ‘ Maughan didn’t like a player who had such confidence in himself. The mind boggles.


The worst decision of the lot is leaving Niall and Anton as subs. Two of our best players sitting on a bench is really really hard to digest.
They are tremendous players and again as with Dunne(30) situation Niall (35) Anton (29) Have many years ahead at this level because simply they are still better than the alternatives.

I’m delighted young lads are called in and in bill carroll and a few other there is real excitement but this idea in Offaly that we need to build a young team, that’s fine if we have a raft Of brilliant underage teams and talent coming through . We need to be practical and pick our best players( regardless of age, so you can be 19 or 36)and try and get to division 2 like a Westmeath or a Laois or even a Longford have managed.

We will beat Carlow well because niall and anton will hopefully (and have to) start.
That will be enough for us to in my opinion easily progress.


I would also ask why was Joey o Connor out of favour then back in ?
Another player that is good enough to start. He did well today in the first half so hopefully he is not injured.

Why is Michael Brazil now gone? A fine solid player who always puts in a shift.

I just can’t listen to another interview by our manager where he is just happy to keep his name in the limelight and be associated with IC football and the attention that goes with that.

Declan Kelly. Pascal Kellaghan. Pat Flannagan. Paul Rouse. Peter Brady.

Please an Offaly manager that cares. That really cares.

SearingDrive
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by SearingDrive »

Tmacmahon wrote: Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:31 am The Ferbane Thing for me is simple

Jack Should be in there on the panel . Brilliant young GK. needs to be nurtured and given confidence by management. Has a Brilliant attitude And wants to get better and learn

The way Maughan has treated ( game time When fit) and referred to Cian in interviews is like he is constantly putting him in his place . This is a prodigious talent who is a lethal finisher and he has a reputation so it seems Maughan wants to show who’s boss. That is just my opinion.

Joe Maher Because he Had a falling out with a selector and or didn’t commit because of studies last year is being completely over looked in a somewhat petty display of management in my opinion.

Leon fox was asked in initially then could not attend the first session and was told no it’s ok.

That’s more than enough.


Nigel Dunne is Cleary better than all six starting forwards without any debate in my opinion. He’s not there , he left the panel because and this is from a player on the panel ‘ Maughan didn’t like a player who had such confidence in himself. The mind boggles.


The worst decision of the lot is leaving Niall and Anton as subs. Two of our best players sitting on a bench is really really hard to digest.
They are tremendous players and again as with Dunne(30) situation Niall (35) Anton (29) Have many years ahead at this level because simply they are still better than the alternatives.

I’m delighted young lads are called in and in bill carroll and a few other there is real excitement but this idea in Offaly that we need to build a young team, that’s fine if we have a raft Of brilliant underage teams and talent coming through . We need to be practical and pick our best players( regardless of age, so you can be 19 or 36)and try and get to division 2 like a Westmeath or a Laois or even a Longford have managed.

We will beat Carlow well because niall and anton will hopefully (and have to) start.
That will be enough for us to in my opinion easily progress.


I would also ask why was Joey o Connor out of favour then back in ?
Another player that is good enough to start. He did well today in the first half so hopefully he is not injured.

Why is Michael Brazil now gone? A fine solid player who always puts in a shift.

I just can’t listen to another interview by our manager where he is just happy to keep his name in the limelight and be associated with IC football and the attention that goes with that.

Declan Kelly. Pascal Kellaghan. Pat Flannagan. Paul Rouse. Peter Brady.

Please an Offaly manager that cares. That really cares.
Pat Flanagan was manager up to 2017. Pascal Kellaghan is with Westmeath, he has a defensive style of football. John Rouse was interim manager in 2018 for a couple of games, but did not opt to continue.
If Carlow beat Offaly next Sunday, which is possible, John Maughan will be gone.
Offaly lost thir last games through an overly cautious approach, the manager must have some influence in that. Division 3 next year will be a tough campaign.

Fairplayalways
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Fairplayalways »

"Jack Cullinane shoudl be on the panel, he is a good youung keeper who needs nuturing"...just because he is a good young keeper doesnt necessarily mean he should be on the county panel, I am sure there are keepers in other clubs who could claim the same, a nice young man and a good up comming keeper, yes it would be interesting to see how he might do, and he probably will get a call up at some stage, does he really want a call up with the way things are going with Maughan, if I were him I would sit tight and tip away with Ferbane...but he is not guaranteed a place on the panel above other keepers who will claim equal skill and commitment...

pigeon house biffo
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by pigeon house biffo »

I'd agree with what was said above. Victory over Carlow is not assured and they will be looking forward to this game having seen the form and lack of attacking thrust we are bringing to the table. To a man, we probably have better footballers but you know that Carlow are going to be well drilled and structured when they do come forward, something which we have shown to struggle against. They have solid midfielders, a centre forward with sigurdson pedigree in jordan morrisey and a forward in Paul Broderick who will get them scores. On current form Eoghan Ruth and Shane Redmond will take some handling too so it is far from a foregone conclussion. If Offaly lost its hard to envision Maughan staying on much longer, he has often alluded to the commute from castlebar to kilcormac and its hard to see him lifting this group much higher than what he has. In terms of the prospective replacements mentioned previously, Pascal K would be an interesting appointment but he probably wouldn't have the most attack minded philosophy. Would be interested to see if Rouse would take back on the job but not sure enough has changed in his proffesional life for him to have a change of heart. I think an internal appointment would be beneficial, would be interested to hear of anyone else that could contend?

Fairplayalways
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Fairplayalways »

oh I think Carlow will give us loads of problems, we will struggle, we may win, we may not, I honestly think its that close, people will say what did Carlow do in Division 4 to warrant our doubt, they finished a postion above where Offaly finished in their table, the have a slightly better scoring difference..the won 3 games, drew 2 and lost 2, thats not a woeful campaign, its a "steady as you go campaign" I would say..they beat and finished above Sligo a week or so ago, hand on your heart, would Offaly brush Sligo aside on current form??..no is the straight answer..this is a defining game for Maughan and Co. as management...

Tmacmahon
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Tmacmahon »

Offaly will comprehensively beat Carlow .
Carlow can only compete if they play that defensive brand of football. They are playing more attacking now and will struggle at the back without the large numbers behind the ball.They change managers not that very long ago so it will take time to break out of that style.

The problem is that this win could keep Maughan for another year. That seems a waste of time at this stage.
3 wins from 11 (league and championship) last year. Beating Sligo and London and Carlow . All division 4 teams.

This year we won 2 from 7.beating Louth and Leitrim who are now relegated so division 4 standard teams.
We will beat Carlow another div 4 team .

Declan Kelly has managed out 20’s and won county titles notably with Lomans this year.

Kellaghan has now worked as a coach with Tipp and Westmeath

Rouse has a brilliant way of communicating and took Offaly out of a bad place a few years back.

Pat Flanagan is actually probably still the best Offaly manager still out there. Wins most places he goes.


Offaly are no world beaters but with a good Offaly man over the team and out best players on the pitch I think we could Be lower half division 2 team . Our best players should be something like this

Patrick Dunican

Colm Doyle
Eoin Rigney
Declan Hogan
Niall Darby
John Maloney
Joe o Connor

Eoin Carroll
Peter Cunningham

Anton Sullivan
Joe Maher
Cian Farrell
Cian Johnson
Nigel Dunne
Niall Mcnamee

SearingDrive
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by SearingDrive »

Tmacmahon wrote: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:10 am Offaly will comprehensively beat Carlow .
Carlow can only compete if they play that defensive brand of football. They are playing more attacking now and will struggle at the back without the large numbers behind the ball.They change managers not that very long ago so it will take time to break out of that style.

The problem is that this win could keep Maughan for another year. That seems a waste of time at this stage.
3 wins from 11 (league and championship) last year. Beating Sligo and London and Carlow . All division 4 teams.

This year we won 2 from 7.beating Louth and Leitrim who are now relegated so division 4 standard teams.
We will beat Carlow another div 4 team .

Declan Kelly has managed out 20’s and won county titles notably with Lomans this year.

Kellaghan has now worked as a coach with Tipp and Westmeath

Rouse has a brilliant way of communicating and took Offaly out of a bad place a few years back.

Pat Flanagan is actually probably still the best Offaly manager still out there. Wins most places he goes.


Offaly are no world beaters but with a good Offaly man over the team and out best players on the pitch I think we could Be lower half division 2 team . Our best players should be something like this

Patrick Dunican

Colm Doyle
Eoin Rigney
Declan Hogan
Niall Darby
John Maloney
Joe o Connor

Eoin Carroll
Peter Cunningham

Anton Sullivan
Joe Maher
Cian Farrell
Cian Johnson
Nigel Dunne
Niall Mcnamee
Nigel Dunne left the panel last year. Joe Maher won't be considered, see earlier comments.
All of the Offaly managers to date have adopted a defensive approach with county teams .
Have you any possible manager who might adopt a more attack minded approach with Offaly, because I would love to see it. I can see relegation to Div 4 a reality next year.

pigeon house biffo
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by pigeon house biffo »

We will be hot favourites to go down next year. Would it necessarily be the worst thing in the world? We could experiment with a new attacking approach without fear of a team tearing us asunder. Would also be an opportunity to try out new lads in a less pressurised environment without the constant worry of relegation.

Its a long way away just yet but I think this group has a lot more to give and in the current division too much emphasis is placed on mere survivial than pushing on to promotion. We are as well off taking a step back to accommodate a new approach as we are staying at the same dross for another 12 months, new manager ot not.

Tmacmahon
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Tmacmahon »

I don’t think it would be good to drop back down although I do see where you are coming from . The confidence of winning can help progress but I still feel we can ( best team on field etc) beat the majority of teams in division 3 And that would be more beneficial.

The reason I go with the 6 forwards I have above is to alienate a defensive or defeatist attitude.

Anton and Cian Farrell have pace and stamina to get up and down the field and both have played most of their football out the field with their clubs , yes they alternate but spend large chunks there. A modern day wing forward needs to be able to get around the field and contribute to the score board as well

Joe at centre forward because he can score and link the play and a good free taker for right hand side.

CJ , Dunne and Nialler are the Three best scorers in Offaly and the three best out and out forwards.


Does anyone have any suggestions other than those mentioned for a potential new manager?

Fairplayalways
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Fairplayalways »

I have to agree getting relegated to Div 4 while very real possibility is not a good thing, look at the scores the teams in Division 4 have been returning, unless we play attacking football, we would be no further really on, only in a different lower division...outside maybe two teams in Division 4, is the standard that many teams in Division 3 are at (Down and Derry being exceptions this year)...for the record, while not a betting man, both Down and Derry wil be beaten in the upcomming championship by one of the higher teams..and I am not talking Dublin or Tyrone, I am talking Monaghan, and then maybe Armagh...that tells one where Offaly are at...if we are going to up our act, division 3 is the place to do it, no point of dropping down and more of the same...

Fairplayalways
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by Fairplayalways »

I am putting 50 uibh fhaili imaginary coins, that Offaly will beat Carlow but by no more than 2/3 points maximum...people will say "we will take that" but it will be only delaying the inevitable....

pigeon house biffo
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Re: DIV 3 NFL predictions and general chit chat.

Post by pigeon house biffo »

there'll be 2-3 points in it, i agree, and it'll be up in the air till the final whistle. Tullamore tribune should be an interesting read tomorrow to get their take on the weekends game, I wonder is the perception of maughan aired here the same as the one that would be in the wider community.

Its probably somewhat unfair to the other teams in div 3 to lump them in with us. Tipp and longford and derry have a more recent history of operating at a higher level than we do, tipp most notably getting to an all ireland semi final not that long ago. In saying all this, if you look at the table at the end of this campaign,Down only won two more than us to get relegated. When you think of the draw with Longford, which we could and should have really won and the ten minute spell against tipp playing with a one man advantage alongside us not starting our strongest team against Derry....we can talk about sliding door moments but if we showed a bit more guile then we could have got the two extra wins required to take us up...then we ar having a completely different conversation...it could be a case that maughan isnt doing a bad job and has instead taken the team as far as he can and someone else needs to come in to add the next level of development, with the talented crop coming up through the ranks and one or two more outside the camp who could maybe be tempted back in, i think it would be a wise choice to appoint a manager everyone could rally around which is likely to be the case only with an internal appointment.

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