Offaly Senior Hurlers 2023

[private joker]

I think the u20s took the reality from a lot of people. We are a long way off the pace, laois, Westmeath get a hammering most of the time the last few years and we are about their level give or take. We are a Joe Mcdonagh team and deserve to be their. We are going in the right direction and it’s getting the foundations built but that will take time.

No point in discussing the match too much but the one point is around an injured player, Cahill needed help and it was slow on arrival, are their stretchers etc in OCP as with the u20s against Galway I think their doctor had to help. Might only be a small issue but could have a major affect on a players recovery.

Not sure when the championships start in Offaly but think this years will be open enough with a number of teams thinking they might do it.

Shocking slow to get into Cahill. Physio could be seen a couple of times gesturing to the line and he also spoke to the linesmen and assume he was asking for help. All the while the game was going on. Eoghan was flat out on the ground and no help/assistance - imagine if he had swallowed his tongue or something. Not good enough.

Was there no doctor again? Every team is supposed to have a doctor as part of the match day mgt. U20s were the same, no doctor vs galway.

[G91]

Shane carroll from banagher is usually the Docter .. very odd

[greenairfield]

Brendan Murphy was there he had gone down the tunnel with another Offaly player.

[private joker]

Then it was just unfortunate

[Bord na Mona man]

The merit of having the beaten Joe McDonagh team continuing into Liam MacCarthy will be rightly examined.
Offaly were going to struggle anyway. But having to train on for 3 weeks after their season effectively ended on a downer is questionable.

In the game Offaly struggled to put on any pressure on Tipp players. The tracking of runners and shadowing was poor. Tipp players continually popping up in empty space for easy scores. A properly hungry and focussed Offaly should have worked harder to stay tighter at least.

While Offaly have come on a long way in being able to play the shorter stick and handpasses, it's still very static. The 3rd and 4th next receiver need to be drifting and dragging the opposition out of shape. Tipp and other top teams are usually playing 2 or 3 moves ahead of what Offaly are doing in terms of developing attacks.
Something also noticeable is the speed at which some Tipp players could travel with the ball. In contrast, some Offaly players are well short of this speed.

3-18 would be a decent score most days. In fairness Offaly did pull up their socks from half time and Tipp faded for a bit, before a late leakage of more goals.

2023 is done with, some targets have been hit, some missed and some more are achievable in 2024, but there is still a massive gap to be bridged over the coming years.

[DerekCarroll]

A completely pointless match today. When you saw the beatings Westmeath were taking in the championship it was always going to be a difficult one as Westmeath are a nice bit ahead of Offaly.

The bigger counties have pulled the ladder up after them. Once the they started harnessing all the advantages they have, primarily population, that was always going to be the case.

The natural size of the Tipp lads today was such a notable factor in their superiority. Worryingly enough I’m not sure there’s one lad over 6ft on the u20 team. You need big lads to have any chance. Has always been the case.

Offaly scored 5 points from play at home to Carlow in a Joe McDonagh decider last year and were bullied. To win Div 2 and be so close to winning Joe Mc the next year has to be viewed as a successful season.

There’s nothing glamorous about playing for Offaly senior hurlers at the moment so thanks to the players for their efforts and sacrifices this year.

As a county, one of these days we might have to accept that the days of competing with the big boys at senior level are gone and there’s no shame in being the best of the rest.

[Plain of the Herbs]

Stop stirring shit again. You know darn well Offaly had a doctor on duty. And you know who he was too.
He was Tipperary's doctor not that long ago.

Was there no doctor again? Every team is supposed to have a doctor as part of the match day mgt. U20s were the same, no doctor vs galway.

[private joker]

It was brought up by two other posters. I didn't know who the doctor was and when greenairfield explained what happened I said "it was just unfortunate " what happened.

[faithfulfanatic]

I think the u20s took the reality from a lot of people. We are a long way off the pace, laois, Westmeath get a hammering most of the time the last few years and we are about their level give or take. We are a Joe Mcdonagh team and deserve to be their. We are going in the right direction and it’s getting the foundations built but that will take time.

No point in discussing the match too much but the one point is around an injured player, Cahill needed help and it was slow on arrival, are their stretchers etc in OCP as with the u20s against Galway I think their doctor had to help. Might only be a small issue but could have a major affect on a players recovery.

Not sure when the championships start in Offaly but think this years will be open enough with a number of teams thinking they might do it.

Shocking slow to get into Cahill. Physio could be seen a couple of times gesturing to the line and he also spoke to the linesmen and assume he was asking for help. All the while the game was going on. Eoghan was flat out on the ground and no help/assistance - imagine if he had swallowed his tongue or something. Not good enough.

The physio has an earpiece and would have been in contact with the sideline, if he needed someone to go across, someone would have went across.

Assume he was asking the linesman for help? That’s a poor assumption to make. Most likely was asking why the game was not stopped by Johnny Murphy, as it should have been.

[old yellar]

Hi men. So we both came to an end yesterday and I suppose it was more or less expected. We gave the dubs a good game but you could see the difference in things when push came to shove. While having another incentive for the Joe mc finalists like these prelim q finals sounds great, most likely it's not going to see a shock. It's so hard prepare for it - both teams would have switched off for a while since, drank a few (a good few!) Pints and mulled over things in different ways. It was so a big ask to step back up mentally I m sure for both and both came facing 2 teams with something to prove/play for - and with no break in their prep. A huge ask. So do t be too harsh on your men. One poster summed it up for me - the reality of where counties like we both are in the greater scheme of things. We re u likely to see the glory days of the 90s/00s for teams like ye/others popping up and driving on. Population/money/etc are now huge factors in where we can go. And as much as ye have a great 17/20s teams in the last couple of years, counties like us need them on a consistent basis to make a break through. And the reality for us both is we can only do our best with what we have. And as much as we want more s/c, more nutrient, more coaching etc the reality is we can only provide what we can financially in our counties. I don't see too many of our players driving sponsored cars, getting nice handy jobs on the strength of their hurling, be eternal students, have their weddings looked after by a wealthy benefactor (,well none of our lads anyways!) Etc. And that's the level of where our competition are at. And more that I m sure I m missing! But for a puck of a ball or 2 ye could have been Joe mc champs, a double year, and a different outlook this morning maybe. But one certainty is be so proud and thankful of what every player who pulls on your jersey gives. It's not easy. Offaly Abu!

[faithfulfanatic]

Hi men. So we both came to an end yesterday and I suppose it was more or less expected. We gave the dubs a good game but you could see the difference in things when push came to shove. While having another incentive for the Joe mc finalists like these prelim q finals sounds great, most likely it's not going to see a shock. It's so hard prepare for it - both teams would have switched off for a while since, drank a few (a good few!) Pints and mulled over things in different ways. It was so a big ask to step back up mentally I m sure for both and both came facing 2 teams with something to prove/play for - and with no break in their prep. A huge ask. So do t be too harsh on your men. One poster summed it up for me - the reality of where counties like we both are in the greater scheme of things. We re u likely to see the glory days of the 90s/00s for teams like ye/others popping up and driving on. Population/money/etc are now huge factors in where we can go. And as much as ye have a great 17/20s teams in the last couple of years, counties like us need them on a consistent basis to make a break through. And the reality for us both is we can only do our best with what we have. And as much as we want more s/c, more nutrient, more coaching etc the reality is we can only provide what we can financially in our counties. I don't see too many of our players driving sponsored cars, getting nice handy jobs on the strength of their hurling, be eternal students, have their weddings looked after by a wealthy benefactor (,well none of our lads anyways!) Etc. And that's the level of where our competition are at. And more that I m sure I m missing! But for a puck of a ball or 2 ye could have been Joe mc champs, a double year, and a different outlook this morning maybe. But one certainty is be so proud and thankful of what every player who pulls on your jersey gives. It's not easy. Offaly Abu!

Hear hear.

Never nice to lose a final, especially the JoeMc final that we were big favs for, but at the end of the day, at least it wasn’t Laois that beat us!

I can’t see the JoeMc runners up going into prelim next year. perhaps it will be top 4 from Munster with top 3 from Leinster and no.4 from Leinster plays joe mc winner?

I can see the Munster elite pushing for that anyway, whether us mere mortals agree to it or not.

All it would do is push the all ireland series further away from the provincials, soon they may be completely separate?

[G91]

Hi men. So we both came to an end yesterday and I suppose it was more or less expected. We gave the dubs a good game but you could see the difference in things when push came to shove. While having another incentive for the Joe mc finalists like these prelim q finals sounds great, most likely it's not going to see a shock. It's so hard prepare for it - both teams would have switched off for a while since, drank a few (a good few!) Pints and mulled over things in different ways. It was so a big ask to step back up mentally I m sure for both and both came facing 2 teams with something to prove/play for - and with no break in their prep. A huge ask. So do t be too harsh on your men. One poster summed it up for me - the reality of where counties like we both are in the greater scheme of things. We re u likely to see the glory days of the 90s/00s for teams like ye/others popping up and driving on. Population/money/etc are now huge factors in where we can go. And as much as ye have a great 17/20s teams in the last couple of years, counties like us need them on a consistent basis to make a break through. And the reality for us both is we can only do our best with what we have. And as much as we want more s/c, more nutrient, more coaching etc the reality is we can only provide what we can financially in our counties. I don't see too many of our players driving sponsored cars, getting nice handy jobs on the strength of their hurling, be eternal students, have their weddings looked after by a wealthy benefactor (,well none of our lads anyways!) Etc. And that's the level of where our competition are at. And more that I m sure I m missing! But for a puck of a ball or 2 ye could have been Joe mc champs, a double year, and a different outlook this morning maybe. But one certainty is be so proud and thankful of what every player who pulls on your jersey gives. It's not easy. Offaly Abu!

Will always admire the commitment it takes to play county it , but I do think there is a slight arrogance amongst some players who don't appreciate the support that travel to watch them play and wouldnt make the effort to have a conversation if you met them down in the local, while there are some that are grounded and very appreciative of support

As for the rest all the benefits that tag along with county , sponsored cars , secured employment the stuff that is unnecessary and ridiculous it needs to put a stop i know the game isn't really an amature sport in a sense anymore but how can the likes of offaly carlow laois westmeath antrim to name a few catch up with teams that have endless amounts to put into the county team turning them into almost professional athletes

Dublin just for example look at AIG they sponsored Manchester united the amount given maybe be different but you can be assured it will be substantially more than what , netwatch , Glenisk ,TEG , laois Hire etc.. can offer and that's nothing negative against any of those you should be sponsored by a local business or someone who doesn't have the profits of some massive cooperation, all glenisk have done for offaly this year is fantastic

Until there's a level playing field in finance and loyalties the gap will get bigger because the big teams will keep winning attracting more funding and the rest will be left behind you may get the odd upset but donal óg pointed it out no new winners since offaly in 81

[Doon Exile]

I think the u20s took the reality from a lot of people. We are a long way off the pace, laois, Westmeath get a hammering most of the time the last few years and we are about their level give or take. We are a Joe Mcdonagh team and deserve to be their. We are going in the right direction and it’s getting the foundations built but that will take time.

No point in discussing the match too much but the one point is around an injured player, Cahill needed help and it was slow on arrival, are their stretchers etc in OCP as with the u20s against Galway I think their doctor had to help. Might only be a small issue but could have a major affect on a players recovery.

Not sure when the championships start in Offaly but think this years will be open enough with a number of teams thinking they might do it.

Shocking slow to get into Cahill. Physio could be seen a couple of times gesturing to the line and he also spoke to the linesmen and assume he was asking for help. All the while the game was going on. Eoghan was flat out on the ground and no help/assistance - imagine if he had swallowed his tongue or something. Not good enough.

The physio has an earpiece and would have been in contact with the sideline, if he needed someone to go across, someone would have went across.

Assume he was asking the linesman for help? That’s a poor assumption to make. Most likely was asking why the game was not stopped by Johnny Murphy, as it should have been.

Cool the jets, only saying what I saw. Physio made what looked like two urgent gestures to the line as no support was coming. He then called over the linesman. Bear in mind that Eoghan was flat out on the ground and didn’t seem to be moving at that point (read on separate place it might be hamstring but it looked serious at the time).

[Fairplayalways]

while a ferocious heavy defeat, as we all agree it shows in hurling terms where we are, Carlow eventually got over hauled by Dublin too in the other game..I am listening now for the last 10 years almost that "we are 4/5 years behind the Limericks and other top teams"..does that gap ever close a bit I wonder after yesterday, its looking like its not, S&C and all that, hard to believe, and this is not a critcicism by the way, that what Offaly are doing in the lines of S&C and general fitness is any great different than what most of the other top counties are doing, Limerick and Tipp etc. cannot be doing anything too much different than what Offaly are doing surely, these lads have to go home after training and work or college the next day, none of the top counties players are brought home in an ambulance or anything after a training session like, the systems cannot be that drastic that Offaly are so far off the pace, again not a criticism before Ime attacked, just my thinking, the physical height rather than the size is something that maybe we have no control over, that said I dont think if S&C etc is correct that shouldnt really a reason/difference, Kilkenny have had plenty of good/great players and they werent tall men...looking at yesterdays defeat and unfortunately I was drawn back to the 2005 Leinster final when Kilkenny done one of their "Good Fridays" on us with a 6-28 to 0-15 defeat, and while a point less of a defeat than the TIpp one yesterday, that Kilkenny defeat was worse in ways..Kilkenny as they do were ruthless for the 70 minutes that day, they couldnt score enough, Brian Mullins was was crest fallen in goals such was the amount of puck outs, yes, Tipp scored 1-09 or 1-10 more yesterday, but they did go out of the game such was their lead, Offaly did get a 3-18 which in the 1980's and early 1990's would guarantee you a win in most games, so not that its going to achieve much but no doubt Tipp will be looking at conceding 3-18 against Offaly yesterday despite being so dominant and scoring so much, the 2005 Leinster final was a worse blood bath I personally think as Kilkenny would have continued trying for goals, Tipps last 2 goals yesterday really came during he thunderstorm when Offaly bodies were on the field and their minds were in the dressing room trying to get out of both storms, the one on the pitch and the weather...Dvision 1 is going to be a long campaign for us I think, hopefully we can give the JMCD a lash again next year and see where that takes us...wishing all players the best now with their clubs..the current system is so crammed they deserve a decent break...

[jimbob17]

We are way off top tier but we knew that already. We need to get underage going as well as we can. We have the 18-20 crop now that will hopefully inspire the 6-12 year olds to get practicing. As much as that may sound silly, it is ten years time we should be looking at. There are probably 6 or 7 Liam McCarthy standard hurlers in the 18-20 crop. We need to produce them consistently and get them into top hurling colleges where they will develop further by playing a high level through Fitzgibbon Cup to bring them on. That is what is needed.

The games programme has improved significantly meaning lads have more games and longer season. The coaching standards needs to improve with it, which is difficult to do at club level.

Beyond that and regarding the current crop of senior hurlers, people have to realise that the top 6 or 7 counties have supreme athletes who are excellent hurlers playing for them. We might have some excellently skillful hurlers who are not supreme athletes playing for us and that is the difference. To make any top county panel, you need to be an excellent athlete as well as an excellent hurler. Not so in Offaly as the depth simply is not there currently. As I see it, Oisin Kelly is a huge loss in terms of his athleticism. The thing is that likes of Cork and Tipp and Kilkenny have 6 lads who can move like him in a forward line and another 6 on the bench. We simply done have them big athletic lads who are able to hurl also. Even Carlow showed us up on this front and there is damn all you can do about it. There are plenty of lads on the Offaly panel who wouldnt make the Ballyhale team. The level is way beyond some of our players and I am not sure that they realise how far off the level that they actually are. I am not saying that is their fault - more a result of playing club hurling in a county where the standard is not all that high. To be fair, in the JMcD final, Carlow were a bit ahead of us and good luck to them.

In stronger hurling counties, every year, they will have 20 hurlers playing at a high level in Fitzgibbon - many of whom will never make a county senior panel. We cannot say that and until such time as we consistently produce more athletic, stronger and more skillful hurlers through a well organised development structure, then we will not get back to the level at which we once competed in the nineties. The u20 crop is a bit of an anomaly and while it is great, we need to have teams reaching Leinster minor and u20 finals more regularly to reap the rewards at senior level.

The only real disappointment for me is that lads have walked away from the panel of late and hope this does not become a trend as we paid big price for that before. I wasn't overly impressed with managers sentiments after the game when interviewed given this is probably his 4th year with this team, 3 of which were as a coach where he would have had significant influence, and a good few of the management set up were also involved under Mi Fennelly, so this year really shouldnt be seen as Year 1 of Johnny Kelly's 'project'. A significant amount of time has gone into getting this group to improve and perform and for me, we don't seem to be a whole lot further on than where we were 2 years ago. We are still struggling to beat the Kerrys and Carlow's and other middle tier counties and yesterdays result only confirms how far we are off the top tier.