Offaly vs Cork

[black and red exile]

So very disappointing. I sacrificed this game for the circus in Aughrim and I must say I thought these type of performances were a thing of the past, but talking to LS and Bord Na Mona man on my way to the football it was pretty clear that the lads never raised a gallop and that Cork were operating very much in second gear.
Also If what Offalys future said was true about the treatment of the players, about the travelling in cars down south and so forth, and Im certain he would'nt print this If it was'nt true, then guys its obvious that If things don't change at County board level this year, and fast, then we will be in such a deep hole with all our County teams that it will be years before this rot is halted.

[Offalys Future]

Two things there. Yes, playing Carroll on O'Sullivan was utter lunacy. Straight up, that was a dumb tactic that was doomed to failure from the outset, I'm not disagreeing with that. However it's not as if we have a Martin Comerford or Dan Shanahan in our team. Right now those two players are around 90% likely each to win All stars - we just don't have those kind of weapons. It's not like Hanniffy or Bergin did anything on him when they went in either.

What i was saying here was that the only way that O'sullivan had been beaten in the past was by playing him to the wings and under high ball, so why from the start didnt Offaly try something like that.

The hurling management from the start this year has been a complete shambles. I have stressed this on so many occasions. They havent a clue how to run a junior team never mind an intercounty team.

This is the kind of gross overstatement that ruins your point. If you had said that this Offaly team took the field unprepared, badly selected and with poor tactics no-one could disagree with you. That kind of "not fit to run a junior team" stuff is only designed to put people's backs up. That was like people on KKcats suggesting that Wexford would be better off in the Christy Ring after the Leinster championship - look what Antrim did to everyone in the Christy Ring last year - what would Wexford do? Likewise McIntyre has won enough to prove that he is well capable at club level, however while I am sympathetic to him last weekend was an abomination.

They have been a joke, an absolute joke.
You tel me what McIntyre has won as a manager so?
And yes all year the offaly team have took the field unprepared, badly selected with no tactics.
McIntyre works in the media so he knows how to play them and thats exactly what he does in his post match interviews, blames everyone except himself.

And lets get something straight, peoples perception is that we are doing great things at underage and thats rubbish.
The underage structure is a complete shambles also.
We beat a poor kilkenny u-21 team in the pissing rain in Nowlan Park and people think everything is perfect. Far from it.

I'll challenge you to find anyone on this site who thinks we are doing even half well at underage in general. We have one good vintage at under 21 hurling who may or may not win a Leinster - that's not exactly stellar. There are steps being taken, and the likes of Rynagh's performance in the féile losing narrowly to Castleknock is encouraging, but there is a long way to go, we all know this.

I am talking about the general perception in the country about Offaly's underage setup.
And steps arent been taking, you go to a ryanaghs u-12,14,16 game see the language used by their officials and their attitude on the sideline. Yet again they will do their best to ruin those young fellas as they have in the past.

And just one thing Lone Shark if you think that David Kenny had a good game on Saturady - well then all i can say is that you must have been watching a complete different game than me.

He gave away a few handpasses and he struggled to live with Ben O'Connor's pace when he ran at him with a head of steam. However he also won some fine aerial ball and got a lot of clearances away, as well as spending half his time covering across for Kevin Brady who was getting eaten alive by Pa Cronin. I honestly can't see who on the Offaly team you think had a better game than him. Seán Ryan maybe, but even he messed up a good few deliveries forward.[/quote]

I didnt say anybody else hurled better than him i just cant see how you could say he can hold his head up after the 70 mins thats all.

And don't think that all this just happened since the defeat to tipp, all the players had to drive to semple stadium too as they had to to portlaois.
When Mike Mac was in charge, Offaly travelled to Cork in the league and they all travelled first class from Templemore.
Preparation is so important in this day and age, Offaly's preparation has been a complete joke since the start of the year.

[Lone Shark]

They have been a joke, an absolute joke.
You tel me what McIntyre has won as a manager so?
And yes all year the offaly team have took the field unprepared, badly selected with no tactics.

Galway championships with two different clubs, including bringing Clarinbridge one step short of the All Ireland when they lost to Birr at the height of their powers. Perhaps not as much as others out there but still hardly "not fit for junior".

I am talking about the general perception in the country about Offaly's underage setup.
And steps arent been taking, you go to a ryanaghs u-12,14,16 game see the language used by their officials and their attitude on the sideline. Yet again they will do their best to ruin those young fellas as they have in the past.

Again, I don't know where you're getting this perception from. Anyone I talk to is well aware that Offaly have been phoning it in at underage for years, and one good batch of under 21s won't change that - a steady flow of decent teams will.

As for the stuff about Rynagh's again you're dangerously close to getting personal there. The fact remains they did well and where they go from here remains to be seen.

When Mike Mac was in charge, Offaly travelled to Cork in the league and they all travelled first class from Templemore.
Preparation is so important in this day and age, Offaly's preparation has been a complete joke since the start of the year.

My point holds from before - either this is happening because John McIntyre thinks that driving 130 miles is the way to prepare, or else it's happening becuase the county board are watching the pennies due to limited funds. I know which one I'd guess.

[Bord na Mona man]

A couple of points. That is terrible preparation in this day and age.
Driving in a car for hours leaves you in no shape to play a match. I was feeling about 80% after driving a car to Cork.

However this has happened before in Offaly and there have been away qualifiers in both codes where the players have driven there themselves...and lost.

I think Offalys future is right in most of what he says, but at times goes a little far laying the blame on John McIntyre. A lot of the problems will still be there after he goes. If what Daithi Regan said is true, then I would worry about how seriously the players were taking Saturday's game.

There stories of indiscipline that I have heard from both camps this year worry me. When a county has slipped so far back as Offaly, anything that hampers the recovery is dangerous. It's not up to manager to babysit players. If they don't feel pride in the jersey, then a man from another county is hardly going to beat it into them.

What has gone on in the last couple of weeks has been worrying. I think both squads lack a few senior leaders and role models to keep younger players in check. We don't want to become Roscommon!

[Offalys Future]

Galway championships with two different clubs, including bringing Clarinbridge one step short of the All Ireland when they lost to Birr at the height of their powers. Perhaps not as much as others out there but still hardly "not fit for junior".

He won 2 county titles and won Clarenbridge won 1 game to qualify for the all-ireland final where they were beaten.
Gerry kirwan won 2 county titles with Clareen does that make him fit to train a county team?

As for the stuff about Rynagh's again you're dangerously close to getting personal there. The fact remains they did well and where they go from here remains to be seen.

Personal, not personal just the truth and if you go to any games yourself you will see this.

My point holds from before - either this is happening because John McIntyre thinks that driving 130 miles is the way to prepare, or else it's happening becuase the county board are watching the pennies due to limited funds. I know which one I'd guess.

If John McIntyre knew what he was doing this wouldnt happen.
And if the county board wont allow this which doubt is true then does it not go back to my point that you have to get the county teams, underage structures in place first before wasting money on a stand.


As for Daithi Regan who cares what he has to say, just shows what newstalk are at having him on.
When he was involved with Offaly as selector all he did was curse at lads and discourage them from hurling.

[Lone Shark]

Galway championships with two different clubs, including bringing Clarinbridge one step short of the All Ireland when they lost to Birr at the height of their powers. Perhaps not as much as others out there but still hardly "not fit for junior".

He won 2 county titles and won Clarenbridge won 1 game to qualify for the all-ireland final where they were beaten.
Gerry kirwan won 2 county titles with Clareen does that make him fit to train a county team?

Not necessarily. It makes him more than qualified to train a junior team though. We are not debating whether or not McIntyre is good enough to train Offaly, I'm merely pointing out that saying he's not fit to train a junior team is the kind of overstatement that weakens your arguments.

I would still contend that when you compared the players that Clarinbridge had with what Portumna, Athenry and Ballygunner had, all of which Clarinbridge beat on the way to the final, it still looks like a fine achievement.

My point holds from before - either this is happening because John McIntyre thinks that driving 130 miles is the way to prepare, or else it's happening becuase the county board are watching the pennies due to limited funds. I know which one I'd guess.

If John McIntyre knew what he was doing this wouldnt happen.
And if the county board wont allow this which doubt is true then does it not go back to my point that you have to get the county teams, underage structures in place first before wasting money on a stand.

I remain unconvinced that our teams have as much money available to be spent on them as you'd like to think. A stand is a different issue in that over time it starts to generate money, and anyway there are people who will contribute to something like a stand that would never contribute to day to day costs to the same extent.

As for Daithi Regan who cares what he has to say, just shows what newstalk are at having him on.
When he was involved with Offaly as selector all he did was curse at lads and discourage them from hurling.

No argument here. He lacked subtlety when hurling and he seems to be even less subtle since.

[Offalys Future]

Right the junior team statement is gone am sure he would be able to train a junior team.

I have made it very clear though what i think of mcintyres time in charge.
And while i agree there is still alot of problems within the county including Underage Setup, County Board, Players Attitude, Finance etc. I still feel that he has done a terrible job in charge of Offaly hurlers.

[green&white]

These are facts:
- Offaly players were told before the Tipp game they hadn't a chance of going to Cork and getting a result and they were to concentrate on Tipp & Dublin games
- No sooner than they lose to Tipp than suddenly mac says he believes they will beat Cork
- After every decent perfromance mac says they've stopped the rot or have turned the corner
- Offaly did eat burgers & cips and had to drive themselves to the match
- Offaly never practised a game plan.. ever!
- the players asked to go to Cork friday night.. County board had no problem with it!!!! Management didnt agree!!!


Why????

[corner back]

On a different direction relating to this thread.

will Cork win the all-ireland. their backs are top class and they've been posting big scores.

What do the people who saw both cork and kilkenny against offaly think?

[Lone Shark]

I still think Kilkenny are a cut above myself. I actually think that Waterford, if you could trust them to hold their discipline when they go four or five points down could be the business myself.

[corner back]

Barring a shock in the quarters I think the semi final draw will play a big part. Whichever of the big three manages to avoid the others will have a big advantage.
On the other hand I suppose, if Waterford did manage to beat one of the others in a semi they would be nearly unstoppable with self belief and hunger in the final.

[turk]

I was at the match - the performances overall were poor. Molloy was good and lively when he came on. Sean Ryan was good. Kenny was good too - he kept going and came out and won ball a few times. Cleary kept going and Mullins made good stops. After that there's not much to write to the lads in Kilburn about. I didn't think much of the overall management/mentoring. There's not much chance of going down and beating Cork in their backyard - they're a class act, as a team and as individuals. You'd still expect we'd leap into them a bit.

A few bad management points:

Carroll was hauled off after 15 minutes - right, he wasn't going well at all but no worse than anyone else and sure it's madness putting him on top of O'Sullivan and not hitting him any proper ball. Carroll stood at the fence after being hauled off, no acknowlegement to and from McIntyre and he remained there during half time till a couple of subs came over to chat him.

Franks was getting destroyed all game, no change or switch till about ten minutes till the end.

The Hanniffy weren't up to the pace at all. Rory threw himself about a bit. I can't see why Gary stayed on all game or what was going on. I've a lot of time for these lads. But you can't leave key players being ineffective all game.

Joe Bergin was left off - his form was debated here already - is leaving him off though the way to shake it up and bring him on when the game is dead. He didn't answer anyone when he came on but by that time it's clear that management has lost the players' heads.

At the end McIntyre was just wandering about on the pitch. A psychologist might be able to describe the situation more intuitively but to me the whole body language area stank.

I've a lot of time for all the lads, and it saddened me greatly to see this match. I'm not a great supporter for going to every match or anything near it. The lads are out every week and are doing their best where they can. I think McIntyre's done three years now and it's time for change. It was a tough year, one positive thing is that over the three years we did get to play nearly all the top teams in competitive action - all bar galway i believe. We can measure the success by what we beat over that time.

It's time for a change and a review of where we are and everyone come on board to go further. this will be discussed again.

PS The Cork crowds we met were absolute gents