National Foothall league Div 2 predictions

[greenairfield]

I think after winning the 20s we needed to protect everything we had in the county. Maugham has ran his course this no disrespect and I am not sure if anyone else would do much better but what we need is all the best footballers within the county playing with the seniors and blending in the u20s very very slowly.

Would Declan kelly not be the best man for the job on a 5 year building basis ?

[pigeon house biffo]

Just disappointed if you look at his reign in general.

Are we any closer to the next tier of teams in leinster? Laois kildare westmeath are all capable of making leinster finals, we still seem content with moral victories, plucky defeats to kildare and meath but are we any closer to beating them in championship? Not so sure.

Conflicted about the idea of blooding lads too early. We dont have clifford or o shea level talent so probably hesitant to let lads cut their teeth too early.

Thought molloy made a comment yesterday regarding the forwards, wether or not what was on the field was the best 6 forwards in the county. Cian Farrell, Johnson and Bryant would be a nice little inside line, if not lacking in physicality. Been impressed with Hyland, tho not heard much of him coming up, has anyone any insight?

[jimbob17]

For me Martin Murphy of Gracefield is the man for the job if it came to it. Look what he has done with Portarlington. Did fierce well before with likes of Gracefield among others and has improved teams everywhere he has gone - including Cappincur if I recall correctly. He is hugely experienced and for me, deserves it over anyone if looking for inside candidate.

Declan Kelly has done extremely well with underage but you have to remember that the Lomans team he picked up were as good as Leinster Champions when he took over. Has he improved them? not so sure but he should definitely be involved in any new senior management team with a view to a succession plan possibly in couple of years. For Offaly I would prioritise Kelly staying with 20s for another spell to reinforce our underage improvements of late and prep lads for Senior Football in medium term.

Hyland is also a very good hurler for Clodiagh Gaels. As far as I recall, he played minor football and u21 for a good few years before emigrating to USA or Australia for a while and only returned recently. He might have been on the u21 team that made a Leinster Final v Dublin a few years ago but don't fully recall. He was always a young player that was being talked about but as he is not from a glamorous club (Raheen), he wouldn't have been seen in Senior championships or given the air time that is often afforded to good young lads from Ferbane, Rhode, Edenderry and Tullamore, sometimes to their detriment!

[Fairplayalways]

here we go..."protect our U20s"...Mayo had two (at least) 18 year olds in their squad..I cannot understand this molly coddling...stay minding them and then lob them into a big championship game and they get a belt and are injured long term and we never see them again.

[Faithful follower]

I don’t agree with throwing in the u20s for the sake of it , these young players need to physically read for senior and in my opinion some of these lad are ready to compete at senior yet . Horses for courses young carroll was three weeks over age for last year u20 all Ireland winning team and he’s doing quite well at senior but he’s possibly over six foot and has filled out. The gaa in its wisdom scrapped u21 and I feel that while some players may be able to step up to senior in general it’s a least two years too early for most of them especially if a player is small in stature. What’s the point in putting them in too early and shattering their confidence plus the possibility of undue of injuries . There’s a lot more that could be done in the county to make sure all these young players can play at the highest level and the be ready for the county senior. Ask how many of last years u20 players that don’t have access to senior football within their parishes now the is the real concerning factor for the Offaly gaa to deal with.

[Lone Shark]

Jaysus but there's some daft stuff on this thread about this game.

When it comes to lads that are still U-20 in 2022, I take the point that U-20 is probably the place for them, and Cormac Egan in particular would be a man who is playing a crazy amount of sport and isn't yet at the level to make a difference at senior intercounty. Maybe next year, when he's still U-20 again, but certainly not in 2022.

However Jack Bryant, Kieran Dolan, Cathal Donoghue and these lads are overage for U-20 this year, so they are now up to the age of senior level. If you decide they're not good enough yet and need to improve, then so be it, they have the time to do so. But if they are the best player available to you now, then you pick them.

As for the comment that "we need the best footballers in the county playing with the county" - what the hell is that about? The best footballers aren't playing because they're not available, if we had Jim Gavin in charge that would be the same. We've lost our starting full back, our starting full forward, and both starting midfielders from last year. If a Division One county came looking at Offaly in 2021 and told you could pick six players from here, then Peter Cunningham, Cian Farrell and Eoin Rigney would be on that list for every single manager worth his salt, and Eoin Carroll would be in the conversation too.

Now I don't know what's the story with Carl Stewart, and equally I'm not sure why John Moloney wasn't there on Saturday either, as those are two men who are well able to mix it with anyone in terms of physical football in the middle third of the field. But again, I'd be stunned if the reason they weren't there was anything to do with the management not choosing the best players. As for people mentioning Cian Johnson, let's wait to see can he get back onto a field for Ferbane before talking about him as a potential county player again.

For me, I was surprised that there wasn't a role for Bernard Allen for at least 20 minutes, and I would be concerned at the suggestion that there were reasons why Ciarán Donnelly wasn't there, as he's a player that I think we'll need this year, he has come on a long way. But equally, I'm not on the training ground, so I'm conscious that there could be good explanations.

[Lone Shark]

I don’t agree with throwing in the u20s for the sake of it , these young players need to physically read for senior and in my opinion some of these lad are ready to compete at senior yet . Horses for courses young carroll was three weeks over age for last year u20 all Ireland winning team and he’s doing quite well at senior but he’s possibly over six foot and has filled out. The gaa in its wisdom scrapped u21 and I feel that while some players may be able to step up to senior in general it’s a least two years too early for most of them especially if a player is small in stature. What’s the point in putting them in too early and shattering their confidence plus the possibility of undue of injuries . There’s a lot more that could be done in the county to make sure all these young players can play at the highest level and the be ready for the county senior. Ask how many of last years u20 players that don’t have access to senior football within their parishes now the is the real concerning factor for the Offaly gaa to deal with.

Back to this again. There are 32 counties on the island of Ireland, and there are two of them that have a mechanism where every player has access to playing senior football (or hurling). In both of those counties (Cork and Kerry) there are massive playing numbers, and there is also an understanding that if you want to play at a higher level than your club, i.e. for your divisional team, that will only work if you don't hurl as well. Offaly would have some craic putting together divisional teams when you'd need single code players only.

[Lone Shark]

From listening on radio laz molloy was saying colm doyle was very poor?

Thought pearson would have been worth a run based on recent form

Maybe looking for a spot for his own club man who was taken off very early - wouldn't surprise me at all. Doyle is a good player, nothing Flash but does basics well and is clever in possession

It doesn't surprise me that there are conflicting views on Colm Doyle, because I find my opinion of him as a footballer oscillating wildly over the course of a single game. He puts in plenty of effort, covers every blade of grass, and is sharp on the ball absolutely. He puts in tackles, makes key contributions on the overlap and in supporting runs, and generally gets involved. I'm always positively disposed towards someone who keeps looking for ways to get more involved in a game and to do something positive, as opposed to the guy who tries to avoid blotting his copybook, and Doyle is definitely someone who's out there actively trying to win a game, as distinct from trying to not make a mistake.

But the other side of it is my God, he does make some mistakes. Running the ball into groups of tacklers and getting turned over is a common one, and as for the tackle at the end of the first half that saw him get booked on Saturday, it deserved a yellow card for the sheer stupidity of it. Offaly had worked hard to turn Meath back the wrong way and they were about to recycle the ball out of the scoring zone, and he comes in with a wild hit that would make a defensive coach pick up the phone and call the Samaritans for emotional support. You've to do a lot of simple good things right to compensate for handing the opposition a score on a plate like that.

So in a nutshell, you could have an analyst that says Doyle is playing well and you could have an analyst that says he's guilty of some very bad mistakes and they could very well both be right at the same time.

[greenairfield]

Lone shark or posters....what is the best Offaly 15 within the county no injuries and eveyone available to the panel I'm interested to know. You can include farrell Cunningham Brazil if you wish.

[pigeon house biffo]

Dunican

Hogan rigney darby
Egan Maloney Pearson

Hayes Cunningham

RuMac Anton

Panda Nialler Farrell

Just shooting off the top of my head. Probably a few that I’ve missed out on. Liked the look of stewart from clara, look at the size of the westmeath players conellan and luke loughlin, or laois evan carroll or sean byrne or lillis, we need more lads that are able to mix it physically. Would try fit in o conner too who is a top athlete and a stand out player at his grade in Offaly

[Lone Shark]

Lone shark or posters....what is the best Offaly 15 within the county no injuries and eveyone available to the panel I'm interested to know. You can include farrell Cunningham Brazil if you wish.

I mean, I know what you're trying to say, but surely you see how irrelevant that is? Not alone that, it's damaging to the players that are there now.

Absolutely, if we could pick from everyone, of course Cunningham, Farrell, Brazil, Eoin Carroll, Rigney would get included, all day and every day. You could also make a case for (for example) Cian Johnson if fully fit, for Oisín Kelly if he wasn't hurling, for Seán Pender if he wanted to commit to it, but NONE OF THAT MATTERS. Now if these guys were fit and making themselves available for selection and management was choosing to look elsewhere, that's a different debate, but that's not the case.

There are a variety of different reasons why they're all not there right now, and it's an insult to those that are available for selection and that are putting the hard work in, that they're being measured up against guys that aren't. They're effectively being asked to compete with ghosts, with an idea. It's like marrying a woman whose first husband, a fire officer, died trying to pull orphans from a burning building. You're always going to struggle to live up to that.

You might as well ask would Ciarán McManus, Vinny Claffey and Peter Brady at their peak improve the team. I mean, yeah, they would, but that's not how life works.

[The Magpie]

Lone Shark has touched on something that is evident on this board, but also across the county. The expectations that people have on the U20 footballers to progress and carry Offaly forward are extraordinary.

Last year was a real fairy-tale for Offaly. It felt great to be back in Croke Pk winning a final. And I really do think that we have some fine young footballers in that group. But remember, they were the best U20 team in a given year. It doesn’t naturally follow-on that in 6 or 7 years’ time, they’ll be the best senior team in the Country – or even Leinster. A strong senior panel is generally built on layers or successions of good underage teams.

In 1997 & 1998, Offaly won a Leinster football championship and National League title. The back-drop to winning those titles was a number of successful underage teams. From memory:

1986: U21 All Ireland Finalists (Peter Brady, Finbar Cullen)
1988: U21 All Ireland Winners (Phil O’Reilly, Tom Coffey, James Stewart (98))
1989: Minor All Ireland Finalists (Finbar Cullen, Sean Grennan)
1995: U21 Leinster Winners (Padraig Kelly, Cathal Daly, John Kenny, Ciaran McManus, Colm Quinn, Roy Malone, Barry Malone, John Ryan (98))

From the players used from the two finals (97 & 98), that only leaves: Larry Carroll (97), Ronan Mooney, David Reynolds (97), David Foley (98), James Brady (98), James Grennan and Barry Mooney (98). Again (from memory), from that group, 1988 came about a year too early for David Reynolds and Larry Carroll, while Ronan Mooney and James Grennan would’ve missed 1995 by a year or two.

There’s almost no doubt that success at senior level is preceded by success at underage level. And success at underage level generally has to happen more than once – possibly across 2 generations of footballers, before you’re lucky enough for it to translate into something at senior level.

We should keep this in mind when setting our expectations. And rather than burdening the class of 2021, look for signs that there might be some future underage success to bolster the great bunch of U20 footballers that we're lucky enough to have.

[Anonymous1]

So here is what I think our best 15 is:

Paddy Dunican
Declan Hogan
Eoin Rigney
Niall Darby
David Dempsey
Johnny Moloney
Eoin Carroll
Jordan Hayes
Peter Cunningham
Ruairi Mcnamee
Anton Sullivan
Cian Farrell
Cian Johnson
Niall Macnamee
Bernard Allen

Here’s the subs we currently have:

Ian Duffy
James Lalor
Rory Egan
Lee Pearson
Ciaran Donnelly
Colm Doyle
Cian Donohoe
Kieran Dolan
Mark Abbott
Cathal Mangan
Aaron Leavy
Dylan Hyland
Bill Carroll
Jack Bryant
Cathal Donoghue
Cathal Flynn
Cormac Egan
Morgan Tynan
Jack Darcy
Keith O’Neill

And here’s a list of players that could/should be involved:

Carl Stewart
Shane Horan
Joe Maher
Joseph O’Connor
Michael Brazil
Conor Mcnamee
Oisin Kelly
Leon Fox
Sean Pender
Paul McConway
Shane Tierney
Sean Doyle
Jack Quinn

Takeaway: Our best 15 is without a doubt good enough to be a mainstay in Division 2 and make Leinster Finals, the difficulty is I’m not sure we’ll ever actually see our best 15 players all on the field at the same time.

Thoughts?

[Bord na Mona man]

Will O'Callaghan put up a video of the Meath goal.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1498409040359182350

Is there any reason why the goal scorer wouldn't be considered to be in the square?

[Claffey]

Just checked square ball rules (below). I guess the ref/umpires thought exception 1 applied or didn't know the rule. But it seems conclusive from the video that the player was not legally in the square when the ball arrived:

RULE 4 - TECHNICAL FOULS:
4.10 For an attacking player to enter opponents’ small rectangle before the ball enters it during the play.
Exceptions:
(i) If an attacking player legally enters the small rectangle, and the ball is played from that area but is returned before the attacking player has time to leave the area, provided that he does not play the ball or interfere with the defence, a foul is not committed.
(ii) When a point is scored from outside the small rectangle and the ball is sufficiently high to be out of reach of all players, the score shall be allowed even though an attacking player may have been within the small rectangle before the ball - provided that the player in question does not interfere with the defence