2017 Walsh Cup

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.

Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby kaiserchief » Tue Jan 31, 2017 2:43 pm

Yeah sam88885a, tham lads are finished and wont be back into the panel this year. This is either by their own choice or history with county panel and county board and their decisions have to be respected.

I agree with greenairfield, we will be back in Christy ring within 5 years.

The first league game against Galway will show exactly of how far we are behind.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby sam88885a » Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:01 am

i watched this years minor county final i think the hurling was of a decent standard and there are a number of guys on both teams that i think with good coaching can develop into senior hurlers of a decent standard s o there is hope if the work is put in .
last year we played in the lenster u21 final so there is talented guys there too .
Surely we can avoid the Christy Ring Cup sign may not be good but there is always hope.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby private joker » Wed Feb 01, 2017 11:33 am

Think offaly minors this year are good. Could potentially make a leinster final. But it's a tricky grade and young lads can just have an off day and your gone.
In regards to u 21s contesting last year's leinster final, they were on the soft side of the draw avoiding the 3 best teams at under 21 level so it's hard to gauge the talent coming from that group.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby kaiserchief » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:57 pm

it will be 4 to 5 years before any of them lads would or even should be cosidered for a senior team.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby Plain of the Herbs » Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:03 am

The intervarsity championships are currently in full swing – the cream of the country’s hurlers who are aged between 20 and 23 (or thereabouts) are involved.

I recently obtained the squad lists for each college. Each college named a panel of 35. 16 college teams. 560 hurlers. The cream of hurling. Of that 560, a mere eight are from Offaly.

Eight.

Think about it for a minute.

There are several clubs who have more than eight on the list.

A number of Westmeath's leaders are on the list - Tommy Gallagher, Tommy Doyle, Killian Doyle, Andrew Mitchell, Robbie Greville, Derek McNicholas are all listed.

It is a damning indictment of the inadequate standard of Offaly underage hurler that so few are deemed good enough to be selected on a Fitzgibbon Cup squad. Unable to gain possession, unable to use possession, unable to tackle, inadequately conditioned. Third world.
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby jimbob17 » Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:36 am

Fully agree Plain. It has been a problem for years, not just hurling but football also. 8 out of 560 is one 70th of the numbers. Now for a supposed hurling county, that is absolutely pathetic. All our U21 county players should be looking to be making these squads if serious about their hurling!

An even clearer indication of what we are at is how many from Offaly are on a starting team in likes of UCC / WIT/ LIT/UL. Is there even one? Guinan possibly in UCD? but UCD wouldnt be even in the top 6 colleges any more with emergence of Carlow IT and Mary Immaculate College.

Some here have credited the Offaly U21s last year getting to a final as success. It isnt! Who did we beat to get there - Kildare & Carlow - hardly a huge success? Wexford Dublin Kilkenny and Westmeath were all on opposite side of draw and we were hammered in final after gamely first half when playing with breeze - and hammered we were. An eight point loss is a trimming in my book! The difference in the level of conditioning between the two teams was stark that evening and had we not taken them by such surprise in 1st 15 minutes, it would have been 15 points or more. The scary thing is that most of these lads now make up senior panel at expense of a lot of better conditioned 23-30 yr olds!

We have a tough few months ahead of us and i'd fear its a relegation shoot out between ourselves and Kerry for the drop. I hope Kevin Ryan knows better but i'd fear for the teams progress going forward.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby kaiserchief » Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:15 am

Please note that not all lads of that age who go to college play college hurling. An example Conor Mahon was in UL for 4 years and never played hurling with them and I'm sure he would have be fit to start on it.

How many of our last year u21's are in college in these top 6 colleges you are talking about? I wouldn't think too many.. Kiely is an apprentience and would definitely be on any of them college teams. What about Emet Nolan (business owner), Oisin Kelly, Paddy Delaney, David O Toole, Ben Connelley... are these lads in college?

SCOLORSHIPS.. The main reason some GAA go to college, be it for one or two years.. I seen Austin Gleeson got a scolorship to WIT for €3000 and a sponsored car. Sure whu wouldnt he go to college.. Fuck the degree or qualification, 'sure I locve my county'', BOLLIX, may hay while the sun shines.
Conor Doughan did this for a year at IT Carlow and played center back and was ranked one the best seen by DJ Carey. Couldnt stay at IT Carlow because he wasn't doing well in college and now finds himself in Grants.

In 2015, Brian Lohan was the UL hurling manager, 13 Scolorships given out for hurling, 9 Clare, 3 Limerick and 1 Tipperary.. Of the starting 15, 10 Clare, 4 Limerick and 1 Tippereary.. 3 Offaly lads where subs and got between them 12 mins Fitzgibbon hurling. 2 of them played in a club all ireland the previous year.. Now there has to be some bias there..
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby greenairfield » Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:31 am

Kaisechief conor mahon would not of been good enough to make the UL team back then as it was a team full of top county stars all over the team, he done most of his best hurling at Club level for Kilkormac at a later age.

David King was in college there also and he made the bench as did Emmet Nolan and they would be two of our top hurlers at this stage so that shows you where we are at.

Shane Dooley, Dylan hayden, Sean Ryan, Michael Verney (UL) Cathal Parlon (Wit) all these guys were at there peak and played some part with there colleges but they still were not the college main players on the team.

We are miles off now as players back then we're mixing it with the best of young hurlers, now we are unable too!!

I would love to know how many lads under 22 that hurl in offaly are studying in colleges..I would imagine it's a nice number!
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby kaiserchief » Fri Feb 03, 2017 10:52 am

What are you on about? He was midfield on the county team that year and in portlaoise got man of match against Killkenny. I am saying it was his choice at the time not to play.

Shane Dooley was 27 in college in UL and already an established county hurler... (got sent off in semi final of fitzgibbon) and so was Brian Carroll. Are we talking about 22 year ols or mature students using theie status for Scolorships and free fees.

'' I would love to know how many lads under 22 that hurl in offaly are studying in colleges..I would imagine it's a nice number''.

Take last year county under 21 panel... how many in college, where.. 20 names of lads that played Leinster final..

E Cahill
C Doughan
D O’Toole-Greene
P Delaney
D Healy
B Conneely
D Doughan Grants Birr
D Wyer
P Guinan UCD -midfield on fitz
J O’Toole-Greene UCD - sub on ucd team
D Murray
R Hughes
A Cleary
E Nolan Entreprenuer
O Kelly
C O’Brien
C Freeman
JP Cleary
L Langton Works in Elverys
E Parlon
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby greenairfield » Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:45 am

All I am saying is mahon would of struggled to make the fitzgibbion team in UK like many of our of fall hurlers...Dooley struggled for UK for example!!
E cahill is in the birr area not sure what he is doing..
Conor Doughan is in grants also.
Murray was also in grants.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby sam88885a » Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:09 pm

Plain of the Herbs wrote:The intervarsity championships are currently in full swing – the cream of the country’s hurlers who are aged between 20 and 23 (or thereabouts) are involved.

I recently obtained the squad lists for each college. Each college named a panel of 35. 16 college teams. 560 hurlers. The cream of hurling. Of that 560, a mere eight are from Offaly.

Eight.

Think about it for a minute.

There are several clubs who have more than eight on the list.

A number of Westmeath's leaders are on the list - Tommy Gallagher, Tommy Doyle, Killian Doyle, Andrew Mitchell, Robbie Greville, Derek McNicholas are all listed.

It is a damning indictment of the inadequate standard of Offaly underage hurler that so few are deemed good enough to be selected on a Fitzgibbon Cup squad. Unable to gain possession, unable to use possession, unable to tackle, inadequately conditioned. Third world.


The real question is in ur 16 colleges how many Offaly hurlers are there in total and how many of those offaly lads between 20 -23 are first choise players at they top clubs such as St rynagh KK birr clareen coolderry shinrone kinnity and belmont. ??
Its easy put up a stat saying only 8 offaly lads are able in make the collage panels but is there 20 guys between 20-23 from the top clubs in any of those colleges???
If guys are not there they cannot make the team.
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby kaiserchief » Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:29 pm

sam88885a.. also always your copy and pasting what is said before.

so now we have:

E Cahill -not in college
C Doughan - Grants Birr
D O’Toole-Greene
P Delaney
D Healy
B Conneely
D Doughan
D Wyer
P Guinan UCD -midfield on fitz
J O’Toole-Greene UCD - sub on ucd team
D Murray Grants Birr
R Hughes
A Cleary
E Nolan - Entreprenuer
O Kelly
C O’Brien
C Freeman
JP Cleary
L Langton Works in Elverys
E Parlon


so of 8 lads we know so far 2 are in college.. lets try fill out other 12...
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby sam88885a » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:00 pm

[quote="jimbob17"]

Some here have credited the Offaly U21s last year getting to a final as success. It isnt! Who did we beat to get there - Kildare & Carlow - hardly a huge success? Wexford Dublin Kilkenny and Westmeath were all on opposite side of draw and we were hammered in final after gamely first half when playing with breeze - and hammered we were. An eight point loss is a trimming in my book! The difference in the level of conditioning between the two teams was stark that evening and had we not taken them by such surprise in 1st 15 minutes, it would have been 15 points or more. The scary thing is that most of these lads now make up senior panel at expense of a lot of better conditioned 23-30 yr olds!


we seem to be behind in conditioning at minor and u21 level but then our lads should mature later at 24 -25 but by them most are retired. Crazy ?????
i think we still have talent to be better than we have been , here a team without j Demsey J Bergin S Dooley S Ryan or J Mulrooney .
We need to keep them all involved and insure that they are all playing at 26 - 27.
A Cahill
M Cleary
D Shortt
S Gardner
A Tracy
C Doughan
P Camon
D King B Connelly
P Murphy
S Kinsella
C Kiely
E Nolan
O Kelly
S Cleary
The problem is we are asking boys to do mens jobs imagine if we had that team playing the mature guys like below in training every night how quickly the would develop.
j demsey
K Grogan
E Murphy
D Mooney
S Coughlan
C egan
B Leonard
S Ryan
G Kelly
C Slevin
C mahon
S Dooley
J Mulrooney
J Bergin
D Currams
Most of those guy are not there for what ever reasons, all are at their prime and are the leaders at club level . we cannot made guys get involved but its vital in my opinion that we dont continue to lose guys as the reach their peak.
That is much more important than whether a guy made a college team or not in my opinion .
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby old yellar » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:25 pm

Lit - last night had oisin Kelly on their fresher's panel..
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Re: 2017 Walsh Cup

Postby old yellar » Fri Feb 03, 2017 3:39 pm

As for Fitzgibbon/county thing, well I think one poster said to look at the ul situation - Clare mentor, multiple Clare scholarships! Ucc too are dominated by cork/Munster players. Some college mentors tend to look after their own. Also some will let some high profile players away with a bit more than emerging players from other counties. For some lads, and I know from experience with some carlow lads, that because of the distances involved, you are either choosing Fitzgibbon or county as both sometimes can't work. Others too have travel issues at start of college year if they are still involved with club 100 miles away. Might miss a few uni games and then decide on a break around now after a long club year. Its often not as simple as I m in college, I play county hurling, I then must play with my college. Possibly some of the lass that are staying away are working part time to fund their digs etc so cant commit to fitz panels, but are then free to hurl with county. More to it than meets the eye!
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