Managers

[Barracuda]

During which of the following managers reign (in your opinion) did we enjoy the most success with the Offaly Footballers"

[Barracuda]

Can we stop the poll now... (lol)

[TheManFromFerbane]

I would have rathered the question being under which manager did we make the most progress. Which when you don't win any trophies is the most important thing.

This is how I feel about the issue: I am ranking the things that I think are most important to the county rated 4 to 1 and then how I feel each manager did in them rated 4 to 1. I hope it makes sense:

Kelly Fahey Kilmurry Roe
4. Trophies 0 0 0 0
3. Progress 3 2 1 0
2. Results 2 2 3 1
1. Performances 3 2 2 1

Kelly 3x3 + 2x2 + 1x3 = 16
Fahey 3x2 + 2x2 + 1x2 = 12
Kilmurry 3x1 + 2x3 + 1x2 = 11
Roe 3x0 + 2x1 + 1x1 = 3

Obviously my opinion and I invite ye to use the same logic even if you have a different order of preference.

[Barracuda]

Thats a different poll now MFF, You got to choose the ratings and you also got to weight them for everyone else.

[Barracuda]

Kelly Fahey Kilmurry Roe
4. Trophies 0 0 0 0
3. Progress 3 2 1 0
2. Results 2 2 3 1
1. Performances 3 2 2 1

Im a bit surprised you dont rate the championship in 06 as counting for much under either progress,or performences.I would have as I have suggested that getting to a Leinster final would be progress and deserving as a 3, at the very least a 2.
But thats fair enough if thats how you see it.
The only thing is its all a bit confusing now.

[Hyper]

Did we not win a div 2 "trophy" with Fahy - I recall having a sup out of it in the Spa!!!!

[Offalys Future]

Can someone just post years each managers were in charge and the teams they beat and lost against in the championshp under each manager.
Not league - championship please

[DD]

Why don't we throw in Pauric Nolan just to muddy the waters even further?

[TheManFromFerbane]

Thats a different poll now MFF, You got to choose the ratings and you also got to weight them for everyone else.

Well what I meant was that you could chose your ratings yourself, its all opinions, if you reckon results are more important that performances even though you haven't won any trophies then fair enough, thats your call. Its obviously just my rating and how and why I came up with it.

# As for the DIV 2 trophy, I suppose you could call it a cup but it didn't really make us champion of anything if you get my drift. I wouldn't include the tommy murphy if we had won it for the same reason.

# As for the '06 championship I'd be along the same lines as LS on this. I gave him a high rating on results, because the old addage of "you can only beat whats infront of you" holds true. However I thought the progress we made was small if any. We beat poor teams, Dessieless Westmeath are a poor team (I'm not sure but I also think the full back was out that day?) Kildare and Wexford were only average, the loss to Dublin was bad (even though the sending off made it worse) and the loss to Carlow was shocking. He got more wins but no progress was made. I know it might sound like twisted logic but thats how I feel about it.

To put it simply IMHO if O'Kelly's team were to have had the same Championship run they would have also got to the final and would have made a better fist of beating the Dubs.

[azoffaly]

I chose to phrase the question 'Which manager did the best job', and I voted O'Kelly. I thought he was given a mandate to develop young lads, and had made a promising start, only to get the carpet taken out from under him.

Fahy came in in an impossible position I think. Everyone was up in the air over the O'Kelly thing, and he didn't do a bad job. He got the shaft too, in my opinion.

Kilmurray was an odd fish. He got decent results in the Championship, but his tactical acumen, or lack of it, almost made me think it was BECAUSE of his touchline ban, rather than in spite of it. Having said that the aimless, lethargic display against Dublin and the Carlow debacle count heavily against him.

Roe. Very disappointing first year, however I am glad he is there again for the simple reason that yet another head tumbling would cause even more uncertainty. There are all sorts of rumours about player dedication last year, so I'm willing to give him this year to see if he can turn it around. I would have said that he has done the worst job of all 4 so far, unfortunately. I hope he makes me re-evaluate that come August this year.

All in all, I'd go O'Kelly, Fahy, Kilmurray and Roe, in that order.

[the bare biffo]

Jesus lads I find it a bit amusing to see everyone going out of their way to put down the achivement of Kilmurray in '06 and coming up with all sorts of excuses for doing so.

2006 - Beat Westmeath, Kildare, Wexford and lost to Dublin in a Leinster final having Alan Mcnamee dismissed early on in the second half.
The same Dublin team that were the only ones to give Kerry a game (I'm ignoring Monaghan)
There was also a retention of div 1 status in there for good measure.

If it's based on results, Kilmurray was a mile ahead.

That said, I have a feeling that O'Kelly might have achieved more if he had been given the chance, but we'll never know for sure.

[Barracuda]

Jesus lads I find it a bit amusing to see everyone going out of their way to put down the achivement of Kilmurray in '06 and coming up with all sorts of excuses for doing so.

2006 - Beat Westmeath, Kildare, Wexford and lost to Dublin in a Leinster final having Alan Mcnamee dismissed early on in the second half.
The same Dublin team that were the only ones to give Kerry a game (I'm ignoring Monaghan)
There was also a retention of div 1 status in there for good measure.

If it's based on results, Kilmurray was a mile ahead.

That said, I have a feeling that O'Kelly might have achieved more if he had been given the chance, but we'll never know for sure.

Iagree of course with the above,and just wanted to add that I also think O'Kelly might have achieved more if he was left there, but he wasnt! I also think that KK was showing signs of progress too, but was shafted too.

For OF- championship results.

Fahy '03 Laois bet us in Tullamore (first round I think)
Fahy '04 Westmeath bet us in the first round'

KK '05 Bet Louth in the first round and Laois bet us in HQ
KK '06 Bet Westmeath, Kildare and Wexford, Dublin beat us in Leinster final

Roe '07 - Bet Carlow, lost to Dublin
Roe'08 TBA

[Lone Shark]

A few things.

(1) - If it's success is your criteria, the only one who won anything was Fahy - tin pot trophy it may be, but half a loaf is better than no bread. So that's how I voted, bearing in mind the phrasing of the question.

(2) - Barracuda, I accept that you put no store by the backdoor qualifier games, and that's fair enough to decide for your self, but I'd say if you were to ask counties like Longford, Sligo or Westmeath of their opinion of the backdoor it would be somewhat different. A lot of people dismiss it in Offaly, so we never get any where - or else we never get anywhere so we dismiss it. Leaving aside the chicken and egg thing, it is a real opportunity for development which we have not exploited, and to take in a whole picture I think you need to add those results as well. Which are for the record:
03 - O'Kelly - Beat London, beat Clare, lost to Roscommon in ET (Also the Laois loss was after a replay and a dodgy goal against us in Portlaoise let's not forget)
04 - Fahey - Beat Kildare (very well) and lost to Wexford
05 - Kilmurray - Lost to Carlow
06 - Kilmurray - Lost to Laois
07 - Roe - N/A

(3) - I know the Championship is everything, but the league is a lot more relevant than it used to be, and while obviously the weighting is still maybe 85/15, you can't dismiss it entirely. Having said that, Kilmurray keeping us up in 2005 was moderately impressive in this regard all the same.

(4) The touchline ban is another thing that I don't like to talk about since my views on KK are well known anyway, but I'm glad someone else brought it up. Might be coincidental, might not.

(5) Isn't it funny how I'd say nobody on this board agrees with the decision to get rid of O'Kelly, and yet it got through the county board? How fecked up are we that the frickin county board are more short-termist than the fans!!!

[Barracuda]

Well thats that sorted and out of the way.

KK winner alrite - winner alrite.
We Might not all agree but winning Championship games is key and always will be- no matter if lucky or not or against poor opposition.Its a real measure of ones success.If you make progress etc in other areas and bring a team on from previous years it means you will also starting winning Championship games.
I hope JD has this effect with the Hurlers - getting to the recent final is great progress - but only if we see that progress continue through to winning Championship games.

[DD]

We're not comparing "apples with apples" as both Kelly & Fahy only had one year in the job unlike KK who at least had the two years. If you compare Kilmurrays first season it is on a par (at best) or worse than his predecessors and that is the only direct comparison that can be made.
KK's record could be weighed up against P.Nolan's time in charge or Roe at the end of this year but ultimately any other comparison is fairly pointless..