Have Limerick any hope?
I reckon that things would have to go right for Limerick to win but KK wouldn't want to leave their A game in the southeast
All-Ireland Sunday
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Oskar
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Anecdotally down here in Kilkenny, there's not the same excitement about the final as there was last year against Cork. The lad out around Freshford who normally paints his house black and amber for the All Ireland didn't bother doing it this year.
Last year the obsession was with stopping Cork (who they really really hate) from getting the three in a row and doing to them what they'd done to Kilkenny made it all the sweeter. They're assuming they'll beat Limerick, who a lot of people aren't really rating. Hopefully a bit of complacency will set in and that Limerick will give them a good game.
Last year the obsession was with stopping Cork (who they really really hate) from getting the three in a row and doing to them what they'd done to Kilkenny made it all the sweeter. They're assuming they'll beat Limerick, who a lot of people aren't really rating. Hopefully a bit of complacency will set in and that Limerick will give them a good game.
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Mighty Pair O' Hands
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Plain of the Herbs
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At first glance, Sunday’s final appears to be an open and shut case – Kilkenny’s craft and experience coupled with Limerick’s ranking at the start of the year.
However, when we peel away the skin and take a look inside I think a different story emerges. Firstly, we see albeit with the benefit of hindsight that maybe Limerick weren’t that far off the pace. Their defeats over the last number of years (with the exception of the qualifier defeat to Clare in Ennis last year) have been by narrow margins and sometimes in replays. This Limerick team crossed the Rubicon with their win over Tipperary in June. While the standard of hurling in each of the three games may have left a lot to be desired and Limerick looked dead and buried in each match of the trilogy, Limerick showed the determination to haul themselves back to win out in the end.
This is a physically strong Limerick team. They’re good up the middle with a good goalkeeper, full back and centre back and a hard working midfield pairing. The forwards have clicked since the quarter final in Croke Park. While they have a big full forward (though Begley is a limited hurler) they still vary the ball crossfield into the corners. Even Donie Ryan is playing the ball back across the ‘21’ rather than taking on ridiculous shots and soloing needlessly. Andrew O’Shaughnessy is fulfilling his potential and rookie Mike Fitzgerald is hurling well. They need a bigger contribution from the two Morans though. They have been blowing hot and cold during the year. Both were matchwinners against Tipperary though they were poor against Clare. Still, a hungry Niall Moran is a useful alternative to have. The Waterford semi final was the first time they were able to line out at full strength.
What of Kilkenny, who have stormed all before them? To be honest, I feel this year they haven’t lived up to the high standards the have set themselves this decade. Offaly, with a physical disadvantage, gave them loads of it for 55 minutes until the goal went in and Wexford in the Leinster final merely stood back to admire them. We’ll never know what would have happened if Galway’s full back line hadn’t taken leave of all senses and left the door open for Kilkenny to walk through. Galway had them well tied up at the point. At the same time, Ger Loughnane’s approach to managing Galway reminds me of the line from Monty Python’s The Life of Brian- “He’s not the messiah, he’s a very naughty boy”.
The Kilkenny defence has not been found wanting but then again, with the exception of Galway it hasn’t been tested to any great extent. PJ Ryan’s layoff since the semi final is a concern. A goalkeeper needs to remain sharp. Derek Lyng hasn’t really shone at midfield and worryingly for Kilkenny, Henry Shefflin hasn’t operated at anything like his full potential, though he could yet be a matchwinner. Eddie Brennan can be quiet but then can leave teams devastated all of a sudden. A huge amount of Kilkenny’s hopes rest on the broad shoulders of Martin Comerford. If Limerick can stop the ball going in to his sector and/or Stephen Lucey can tie him up then Limerick are gone a long way towards landing the title. The other three Kilkenny forwards haven’t convinced at all this year. A worry for Kilkenny is that they have very few forward options in reserve. Their bench is top heavy with defenders. Ryall, Tennyson, Dalton, Cody, Mullally and Canice Hickey all of whom are defenders while Fennelly and Rice are midfielders.
Richie Bennis was speaking on radio this week. He said something along the lines of “Kilkenny are favourites, we will need to be at our best and Kilkenny need to be something below their best for us to win”. Now, while there will always be cloak-and-dagger stuff like this before a match, Richie is on the mark with that comment.
Traditionally, Limerick have no real fear of Kilkenny. If they had any belief in themselves in their quarter final meeting two years ago Limerick might well have emerged from Croke Park with a win. Ditto in the quarter final against Cork last year when another one point defeat was their lot. They also took on the Kilkennymen in the league final last year and impressed many despite losing out in the closing stages. This was forgotten in the aftermath of the disaster in Ennis and the subsequent change of management.
Kilkenny are rightly favourites but I find the odds of 4/1 on Limerick amazing, especially in a two horse race. Limerick are on a roll and will be well able to produce the required intensity to close Kilkenny down. The expectation on Shannonside won’t be anything near what it was in 1994 or’96 given that it’s Kilkenny they face. If they can take the game to Kilkenny and stop Kilkenny scoring goals, which is vital, I’ll give them a hesitant vote to win it.
However, when we peel away the skin and take a look inside I think a different story emerges. Firstly, we see albeit with the benefit of hindsight that maybe Limerick weren’t that far off the pace. Their defeats over the last number of years (with the exception of the qualifier defeat to Clare in Ennis last year) have been by narrow margins and sometimes in replays. This Limerick team crossed the Rubicon with their win over Tipperary in June. While the standard of hurling in each of the three games may have left a lot to be desired and Limerick looked dead and buried in each match of the trilogy, Limerick showed the determination to haul themselves back to win out in the end.
This is a physically strong Limerick team. They’re good up the middle with a good goalkeeper, full back and centre back and a hard working midfield pairing. The forwards have clicked since the quarter final in Croke Park. While they have a big full forward (though Begley is a limited hurler) they still vary the ball crossfield into the corners. Even Donie Ryan is playing the ball back across the ‘21’ rather than taking on ridiculous shots and soloing needlessly. Andrew O’Shaughnessy is fulfilling his potential and rookie Mike Fitzgerald is hurling well. They need a bigger contribution from the two Morans though. They have been blowing hot and cold during the year. Both were matchwinners against Tipperary though they were poor against Clare. Still, a hungry Niall Moran is a useful alternative to have. The Waterford semi final was the first time they were able to line out at full strength.
What of Kilkenny, who have stormed all before them? To be honest, I feel this year they haven’t lived up to the high standards the have set themselves this decade. Offaly, with a physical disadvantage, gave them loads of it for 55 minutes until the goal went in and Wexford in the Leinster final merely stood back to admire them. We’ll never know what would have happened if Galway’s full back line hadn’t taken leave of all senses and left the door open for Kilkenny to walk through. Galway had them well tied up at the point. At the same time, Ger Loughnane’s approach to managing Galway reminds me of the line from Monty Python’s The Life of Brian- “He’s not the messiah, he’s a very naughty boy”.
The Kilkenny defence has not been found wanting but then again, with the exception of Galway it hasn’t been tested to any great extent. PJ Ryan’s layoff since the semi final is a concern. A goalkeeper needs to remain sharp. Derek Lyng hasn’t really shone at midfield and worryingly for Kilkenny, Henry Shefflin hasn’t operated at anything like his full potential, though he could yet be a matchwinner. Eddie Brennan can be quiet but then can leave teams devastated all of a sudden. A huge amount of Kilkenny’s hopes rest on the broad shoulders of Martin Comerford. If Limerick can stop the ball going in to his sector and/or Stephen Lucey can tie him up then Limerick are gone a long way towards landing the title. The other three Kilkenny forwards haven’t convinced at all this year. A worry for Kilkenny is that they have very few forward options in reserve. Their bench is top heavy with defenders. Ryall, Tennyson, Dalton, Cody, Mullally and Canice Hickey all of whom are defenders while Fennelly and Rice are midfielders.
Richie Bennis was speaking on radio this week. He said something along the lines of “Kilkenny are favourites, we will need to be at our best and Kilkenny need to be something below their best for us to win”. Now, while there will always be cloak-and-dagger stuff like this before a match, Richie is on the mark with that comment.
Traditionally, Limerick have no real fear of Kilkenny. If they had any belief in themselves in their quarter final meeting two years ago Limerick might well have emerged from Croke Park with a win. Ditto in the quarter final against Cork last year when another one point defeat was their lot. They also took on the Kilkennymen in the league final last year and impressed many despite losing out in the closing stages. This was forgotten in the aftermath of the disaster in Ennis and the subsequent change of management.
Kilkenny are rightly favourites but I find the odds of 4/1 on Limerick amazing, especially in a two horse race. Limerick are on a roll and will be well able to produce the required intensity to close Kilkenny down. The expectation on Shannonside won’t be anything near what it was in 1994 or’96 given that it’s Kilkenny they face. If they can take the game to Kilkenny and stop Kilkenny scoring goals, which is vital, I’ll give them a hesitant vote to win it.
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Muck Savage
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well written POTH. I'm down here in Limerick and everyone is writing them off but the players are going on and doing their own thing. At lunch today I had a bit of an disagrement with a few wormates, now one was from Clare and the other Waterford but I really think they'll give KK a very tough game. Like you pointed out POTH, KK have only played Wexford, Offaly and Galway, none of which were up to much but still Offaly and Galway gave them lots of it for most of the game. Limerick won't be found fading the last 10 mins, I don't care how much training KK do but you can't beat 6 hard C'ship games like Limerick have had. Secone point is this is a physically strong Limerick team, they'll match them in that department which Offaly and Wexford weren't able to and Galway weren't much better. Finally, there's no expectations on LK at all. There in a no lose situation unlike '94 and '96 where there was a lot of hype in the county. I'm not sure if Munster rubgy has sucked some of the excitment out of the crowd here but this is the way they want to be going into this. I saw a few of the lads this week and they were very relaxed altogether and really enjoying the whole thing. These lads have three AI U21 titles so they're not totally new to this.
I'm sticking a tenner on them and heading to the game. I've always said that I pity counties who never get to see their home county in an AI final, when the teams are marching around the band it's a sight to behold. I'll be shouting for Limerick with the good missus Sunday and hopefully we'll be having a few happy pints in Limerick Sunday night with me 40 bob from Hackets!
I'm sticking a tenner on them and heading to the game. I've always said that I pity counties who never get to see their home county in an AI final, when the teams are marching around the band it's a sight to behold. I'll be shouting for Limerick with the good missus Sunday and hopefully we'll be having a few happy pints in Limerick Sunday night with me 40 bob from Hackets!
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Offalys Future
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My own opinion of Sundays Final is that Limerick havent a hope in hell.
And the bookies are dead right with their odds.
Limerick are an average side, it took them three games to beat an average Tipperary team, they got hammered by Waterford in the Munster Final. They bet a Clare team without Davy Fitzgerald, Brian Lohan, Seanie McMahon, Tony Carmody, Tony Griffin and Gerry Quinn played even though he was injured.
They beat Waterford in the Semi Final which didnt surprise me one bit as Waterford are big time chokers. Clinton Henessey should have saved two of the goals. Need i not forget that Limerick only scored two points in the last forty minutes against Waterford.
Limerick Team
Murray has done okay in goals
Hickey has been in great form all through.
Lucey has done well considering i dont rate him and Sunday will tell all. He reminds me of the Dublin Footballers very arrogant and little respect for his opponent.
Damien Reale - Hi reputation tells hes great but i dont think so and Sunday he should struggle.
Lawlor/Geary/Foley
Limericks slowest line and watch KK destroy them on Sunday. Geary is very poor and while it hasnt been shown this year i think it will Sunday. Lawlor and Foley lack pace and i can see both of them be substituted.
O'Grady and O'Brien have done okay but o'brien fouls alot and likes to get involved.
M Fitzgerald, O Moran, S O'Connor,
A O'Shaugnessy, B Begley, D Ryan.
The Limerick Forward line wouldnt put the fear of god in much to be honest. O'Shaughnessey has had a good year but you judge a great hurler playing at the highest level against the best opposition, lets see what he is made of Sunday.
Other than him i cant see much threat maybe Mike Fitzgerald.
Last comment on Limerick during the week Ollie Moran gave an interview to RTE he is quoted as saying
'My dream has always been to be ranked and rated among the best in the country and now I am'
Are ya Ollie well not to me you are. These Limerick guys are arrogant, no respect for opposition, over hyped and havent a prayer on Sunday.
Kilkenny by as much as they want maybe twelve points plus.
Man of Match - Eddie Brennan.
Minor game will be a far better match. Cork To Win
And the bookies are dead right with their odds.
Limerick are an average side, it took them three games to beat an average Tipperary team, they got hammered by Waterford in the Munster Final. They bet a Clare team without Davy Fitzgerald, Brian Lohan, Seanie McMahon, Tony Carmody, Tony Griffin and Gerry Quinn played even though he was injured.
They beat Waterford in the Semi Final which didnt surprise me one bit as Waterford are big time chokers. Clinton Henessey should have saved two of the goals. Need i not forget that Limerick only scored two points in the last forty minutes against Waterford.
Limerick Team
Murray has done okay in goals
Hickey has been in great form all through.
Lucey has done well considering i dont rate him and Sunday will tell all. He reminds me of the Dublin Footballers very arrogant and little respect for his opponent.
Damien Reale - Hi reputation tells hes great but i dont think so and Sunday he should struggle.
Lawlor/Geary/Foley
Limericks slowest line and watch KK destroy them on Sunday. Geary is very poor and while it hasnt been shown this year i think it will Sunday. Lawlor and Foley lack pace and i can see both of them be substituted.
O'Grady and O'Brien have done okay but o'brien fouls alot and likes to get involved.
M Fitzgerald, O Moran, S O'Connor,
A O'Shaugnessy, B Begley, D Ryan.
The Limerick Forward line wouldnt put the fear of god in much to be honest. O'Shaughnessey has had a good year but you judge a great hurler playing at the highest level against the best opposition, lets see what he is made of Sunday.
Other than him i cant see much threat maybe Mike Fitzgerald.
Last comment on Limerick during the week Ollie Moran gave an interview to RTE he is quoted as saying
'My dream has always been to be ranked and rated among the best in the country and now I am'
Are ya Ollie well not to me you are. These Limerick guys are arrogant, no respect for opposition, over hyped and havent a prayer on Sunday.
Kilkenny by as much as they want maybe twelve points plus.
Man of Match - Eddie Brennan.
Minor game will be a far better match. Cork To Win
" In The Presence Of Confidence Doubt Cannot Exist "
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Sydthebeat
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Offalys Future
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TheManFromFerbane
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I reckon it'll be a case of Galway all over again. Limerick to keep it tight for about 50 mins and Kilkenny to pull away at the end.
On a side note the buzz down here is awful. People are putting up the flags nearly out of being forced to rather than any real excitement about the game. I suppose thats easy to understand as you can't have the same buzz about it when its your 8th final in 10 years.
However in my opinion Cody is the best manager of my generation and will have his team focused and ready.
On a side note the buzz down here is awful. People are putting up the flags nearly out of being forced to rather than any real excitement about the game. I suppose thats easy to understand as you can't have the same buzz about it when its your 8th final in 10 years.
However in my opinion Cody is the best manager of my generation and will have his team focused and ready.
The night is darkest before the dawn
KK by a few pts after a hell of a battle for 60 plus minutes. KK have huge questions mark over their form. They struggled big time against a miss selected Galway side before pulling through as much as down to Galway's woefull fullback play as their own hurling. Kavanagh and Delaney are shadows of the players they once were. Lyng in decline also. Henry Shefflin is having a poor year. I'd have expected Waterford to have beat them comfortably if they'd have met. Its also noticable , despite the hype, how limited the bench is in terms of forward options. The likes of Aidan Fogarty,Eoin McCormack, Willie Dywer aren't great.
Limerick got v lucky with the semi and quarter final draw. They're still the forth best side in Munster and are v limited up front. Cant see the forwrds being good enough to put up a big score.
Limerick got v lucky with the semi and quarter final draw. They're still the forth best side in Munster and are v limited up front. Cant see the forwrds being good enough to put up a big score.
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Sydthebeat
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Will be busy Sunday and will miss this one.
I expect Kilkenny to take 15 minutes to deal with some physical stuff and then to fight right back with too much force and skill for Limerick to deal with.
A 10 point win. Wouldn't mind being proven wrong but for me it comes down to:
The best manager and the best overall team versus a team that has willed themselves this far.
Limerick just has not played as complete a team as Kilkenny. The buck stops here.
I expect Kilkenny to take 15 minutes to deal with some physical stuff and then to fight right back with too much force and skill for Limerick to deal with.
A 10 point win. Wouldn't mind being proven wrong but for me it comes down to:
The best manager and the best overall team versus a team that has willed themselves this far.
Limerick just has not played as complete a team as Kilkenny. The buck stops here.