Championship - The Way Forward????

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
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azoffaly
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Post by azoffaly »

Alright, in the interests of trying to get you on board, maybe you'll propose it in the Offaly Independant :)

Before I answer your three questions, I would preface my answers by re-stating the following : This must be a formal entity, not a collection of loose alliances. In effect the Divisional team becomes a mini-county team, and a seperate entitiy. Again, an extension of, not a replacement for, the club teams. So, deep breath ....

Overall you'd need to make a lot of things happen before it would work.
(1) Outside selectors and managers would have to be appointed. The biggest danger to the system would be clubs pulling out due to petty squabbling over bias, be it perceived or real. Say you pick a West Offaly team, Erin Rovers, Shannonbridge, Doon and Cloghan would all expect 2/3 players each, Ferbane and Ballycumber would expect four or five at least, and that's before Tubber get included as I assume they would and expecting two or three as well. You couldn't take the field with 23 players, but if anyone falls short of that allocation, or God help us one of the entities get no-one, and suddenly we have a huff. There would have to be huge efforts to make sure it would all be above board and be seen to be above board.
I agree that this would have to be the case initially, at least until the the concept bedded down. There are no external coaches in the South Kerry example. They have a manager and 2 selectors who all come from clubs within South Kerry. There is a South Kerry Divisional board, with delegates from the clubs, who appoint these selection teams. Obviously the concept is mature down there, and they still have inter-club squabbles about selection and such, that is human nature, but everyone knows that this is the representative team of the Division. In the exact same manner as the county team, albeit with a smaller pick, there will be disappointments at exclusions etc etc.
(2) Just out of curiosity, who would pay for the bread and butter expenses involved in training etc.? Does it get paid for at county board level, do you charge all clubs equally, do you charge based on members.....(I'm not trying to stir here, I'm genuinely curious)
I am not sure whether the South Kerry Board gets funding from the Kerry County council, but I would assume so. There are also seperate fundraisers for 'South Kerry' in addition to the normal club lottos and stuff that the individual clubs go through. A key thing to bear in mind is that because South Kerry is a collection of clubs, they do not need a 'ground' or any of the expenses that go with it. The clubs all allow the South Kerry team to train or play challenge matches on their pitches, and in fact it is seen as a perk when it happens. The expenses for upkeep, electricity, maintenance etc are not applicable in this instance, so the expenses are on things like meals, training cones, balls and jerseys etc etc.
(3) How do you seperate fixtures? Do intermediate/junior fixtures take place on separate weeks? Say for example the players come back off county duty and in seven days you play all the junor intermediate matches, but West Offaly want Jimmy Coughlan, Trevor and whoever else from Doon to train once or twice with them during the week? Squabbling over players could get very messy. You could do this with junior teams and junior amalgamations where to the best of my knowledge there aren't any county players in there to mess things up, but otherwise it gets messy.

Again, this is based on the fact that is an established entity now, with the full support of the clubs, and with reciprocal support to the clubs from the Divisional Board. Essentially, the volume of games is fairly low for the Divisional Side, challenge matches and Championship games. They manage to fit the training around the Club training, and coming up to championship games, the Divisional side gets priority. Nothing really ever grinds to a halt for the Club teams, nor do the players be constantly missing.
Shane Gavin. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Ron
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Post by Ron »

Just some general thought on this issue;
An Gaeltacht is noted as one of the smaller teams that have won Kerry Championships. An Gaeltacht were part of the West Kerry Divisional side for a long time (P. O Se's team) but opted to go it alone at senior when they won the intermediate championship.

As I've said on this board before, there are plenty of examples of excellent players playing junior and intermediate in Offaly who don't get a look for the county simply because the don't play senior. Players who are as good any other in the county at underage and who peak at 20/21 under the current system.

Other issue which needs to be tackled at club level in my opinion is the lack of a master fixtures schedule, progress has been made but people should be able to book holidays during the summer knowing that they won't miss an important game. Teams should be guarenteed competitive games on a regular basis.

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TheManFromFerbane
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Post by TheManFromFerbane »

Ron wrote:Other issue which needs to be tackled at club level in my opinion is the lack of a master fixtures schedule, progress has been made but people should be able to book holidays during the summer knowing that they won't miss an important game. Teams should be guarenteed competitive games on a regular basis.
One of the only good things to come out of Offaly's shambolic year is that at least the clubs know they are going to have a proper championship from now on.

LS did a really good proposal on this a while ago. It really is having a negative impact on playing numbers and playing quality that you can't have a gradual build up from fitness to ball work to team work in the club setup because you just don't know when Championship is coming.
The night is darkest before the dawn

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Lone Shark
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Post by Lone Shark »

Unfortunately the structure I proposed necessitated nationwide change as it needed the All Irelands to be run differently. The whole idea was that all bar the semi finalists would be eliminated by next Sunday, meaning that most counties could have their big launch of the local championship on the August Bank Holiday and then have a dedicated 10/12 weeks to run off the championship. It would be a shorter and more condensed season, but I think it would make sense on a lot of levels.


Going back to the divisional teams, I keep seeing little bugs, but I accept that there is a lot of merit to it. However in terms of politics being "The art of the possible" how many of Offaly's clubs do you think would go for it? All bar three or four senior teams would be in danger of dropping to intermediate, while almost all intermediate teams would see senior as being further away than ever and in many cases be staring at going right back down to junior. How do you sell this to clubs like Shannonbridge, Walsh Island and Bracknagh, all of whom would see this as thwarting their future plans?

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azoffaly
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Post by azoffaly »

Aha. That is the crux of the matter. This will not work unless there is a willingness to take part, and also a recognition that it is for the greater good of the county as a whole.

It would be a major sales job, but emphasising the positive benefits to the county, while reinforcining the fact that Clubs can still compete individually if they reach the required standard and wish to do so, would the the tack to take.

I have no doubt there would be a huge volley of opinion against it, at least initially, but with rational debate, at least some progress could be made on it. To be honest, if I was a Ross Connor or someone like that in Walsh Island, I would be delighted to play for North Offaly in the senior Championship, and continue to play for my club at their level until they re-emerge as a big senior club in their own right again. Ditto Sean Ryan in Birr and many many others.
Shane Gavin. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Post by Bogman »

I notice that there was a discussion on divisional/parish teams at the County Board inquest into the Football Year.

Maybe your proposal's time is near, AZ,

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