Offaly Minor Football Team Named

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feirmeoir
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Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by feirmeoir » Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:05 pm

https://hoganstand.com/Article/Index/298245

Best of luck to the lads on Tuesday

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by pigeon house biffo » Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:45 pm

What are the prospects for this minor team? Would they be a highly rated crop?

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by LooseCannon » Tue Apr 23, 2019 1:27 pm

Fixtures and outline of the Leinster championship.
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"The greatest one in a row in history."

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by LooseCannon » Tue Apr 23, 2019 10:43 pm

A one point win. Good stuff.
"The greatest one in a row in history."

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by GAHMAD » Fri May 03, 2019 5:40 pm

Decent win and very important one for the group down in Wexford.
This management and group have worked hard over the last 6 mths.
Thoroughly deserved one although they made hard work of it.
Full back line bar one mistake which led to the goal were very good as was Lee Pearson at wing back. Luke Egan was very impressive at midfield. Forwards went long spells without scoring but did kick some very good scores when they did click. Cormac Delaney landed some serious frees off the ground in the second half but was very quiet from open play.

Meath will be a big test next week but fair play to team and mgt for the work they have put in to date and grinding out the win.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by LooseCannon » Thu May 09, 2019 11:13 am

Offaly lost out on a scoreline of 0-08 to 0-05, having led 0-04 to 0-03 at the halftime break.
The following is a report by Kevin Corrigan for the Tribune:
http://www.tullamoretribune.ie/gaa/2019 ... 6o.twitter
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Geansai Gorm
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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by Geansai Gorm » Thu May 09, 2019 1:44 pm

Oh dear, no scores from play, and defensive football.
For me the point of minor and underage teams is to provide a platform to develop football skills and talent. Playing blanket defence robs young players of any spark of individuality or expression.
It shocks me to hear young county teams play like that. Winning isn't the prime goal, this should be a training and proving ground for potential adult county players.
Putting this crap in players minds is poor form.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by Lone Shark » Thu May 09, 2019 2:20 pm

I wasn't in Navan last night, so I can't say with any degree of certainty whether the team played all-out defence, or whether they just played sensibly, but were undone by a combination of bad conditions and a very talented Meath side, one which has very high expectations.

However in the general case, there has to be a line somewhere where you stop just teaching lads skills and you start preparing them to play proper championship football. I would argue that by the time you get to intercounty minor championship, you're well past that point. And what that means is doing the best you have with the resources at your disposal. It doesn't mean going defensive for the sake of going defensive, but it does mean plotting a way where you can visualise how you might win a game - and I would argue that if that Offaly team took on that Meath team in a straight, 6-2-6 man on man contest, the likely result was an eight to ten point win for Meath.

I don't think it's being unkind to these lads to say that this isn't an Offaly team that would have come into this championship with high expectations. That's not to say that there aren't players with plenty of potential, and for those that didn't stand out, they have plenty of time on their side if they have the right attitude - any member of that panel could yet play senior championship football for Offaly and do it well.

But collectively, they haven't been a standout side going up along, and results at junior schools level for Offaly schools this year were downright poor. Gallen are going through a fallow period, Killina were weak, Edenderry had very few Offaly lads on that team, likewise (I believe) Portarlington, and Coláiste Choilm - from which a lot of players were drawn - made no impression at Leinster "B". You have very few players returning from last year, one of the best of which - your goalkeeper - cannot play due to other commitments, and there are others who chose not to be part of it.

Add to that you're drawn into a group where you have two away games, and you're put in alongside both Dublin and Meath, which are two of the strongest teams in Ireland, never mind Leinster. I have no problem saying that I will not be in the least bit surprised if both of those counties reach the All Ireland semi-finals if they can stay away from Kerry, with Dublin quite likely to do even more.

In that context, this group secured a championship win in Wexford, and they left themselves in contention to pick up another one in Navan, right up until the final whistle. Rest assured, that's overachieving, even if they don't get anything out of the Dublin game next time out.

I would argue that if you have a team that doesn't score much from play, i.e. that there isn't any gifted forwards in there, then setting up defensively to keep the score down is your only option. I abhor this argument that everyone should go out and play traditional football, because that just means that the team with the best players will win - and that's grand, if you are that team. But if you're not, and all bar one team in the race isn't by default, then you've a responsibility to do something different.


Coaches have a responsibility to improve players absolutely, and I've no doubt that looking at this coaching ticket, that's happening here. But sending a team out there against an opponent with far more firepower and exposing them to the potential of a hammering does no-one any favours and will only put lads off.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by private joker » Thu May 09, 2019 6:09 pm

Its a hard one to call. Whats the countys policy on this if there is even one? Develop players ahead of winning? Be competitive playing attacking football?. Go out 15 v 15 regarless? . Mgt have to do what they think is right. The article says they "Payed dearly" for their approach to the meath game. The fact is they didnt. They lost by one score. If they had gone put, full on it would have been 10 plus point defeat. Meath are very highly rated at this level. Paying dearly for me is a massive defeat which did not happen. Unless there is guidence on how underage teams should approach matches , this mgt team and their players have done well as the records will only show results, not how they played. One victory and a narrow defeat. Dublin beat Wexford well and that with 14 men for most of the game. Need to have a sense of perspective going into these matches.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by GAHMAD » Fri May 10, 2019 7:57 am

I have to agree with Lone Shark,

Geansai Gorm probably hasn't attended one of the 20 plus games that this management have organized in preparation. The gym prep has been first class and the management have done their very best to look after the players in preparing them as best they can.
Some of the more experienced players particularly in the forwards have struggled and the management appear to have adapted to a more defensive approach and as Lone Shark said the experience of their top keeper leaving the panel a week before the championship due to pressure from a soccer club doesn't help so to continue on conceding 8pts to a talented Meath side shows positively.

As I said in earlier posts very easy to trot out "Oh Dear" and be concerned on a keyboard, go and have a look. I would agree though that a little more thought needs to go into how forwards and teams are coached right up along to minor (especially at club level), and more kicking of direct long passes to forwards as they develop.

But the level of effort that has gone in has been huge and yes (5 points from frees is clearly a concern), but if I thought Offaly would be able to be level and in contention with 10 mins and a one score game, then I would have been very happy.

There is a separate conversation to be had about the number of players that did not commit to the panel and I think some clubs need to address this with their players.

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Geansai Gorm
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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by Geansai Gorm » Fri May 10, 2019 11:31 am

[ Geansai Gorm probably hasn't attended one of the 20 plus games that this management have organized in preparation ] How many here have? Stupid question, I don't have anyone on the team and I'd say most parents haven't been to may of the games either.

Yes, the county panels are well prepared in the F/Fields, I am out there most Saturday mornings and see the work being done.

But, and I mean but, in MY opinion, a team at any grade scoring 5 points and none from play has to bring questions on the whole setup. I am aware of the stories around of 'better' players not available or not picked or the ones who walked away from the panel.

Harnassing them to avoid a beating is not my view on football, that's all.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by SearingDrive » Fri May 10, 2019 12:24 pm

Just a few thoughts on Wednesday night's game. I was not there, so I rely on Kevin Corrigan's report from Navan. The sense I got from his article was that Offaly could have won that game, if they had adopted a more attacking approach to the game, 5 points all from frees is very poor return. Your first line of defence is your forward line, if they pressurise their opponents, and are scoring, this limits the opposition attacking your goal. I don't like the modern, defensive boring football that is being played nowadays, and I suspect a lot of people feel the same way. No matter how it is portrayed as championship football, it is not very creative or easy to look at.
Reading the comments, it seems Offaly were happy with a 3 point defeat, as to play a more open style would have led to a heavier defeat, how do you know?. A big change from Offaly team's approach in the past.

Meath scored 8 points, so they may not be world beaters, perhaps if Offaly had pushed it they might perhaps have won.
I would rather see a team entertain, than bore me, and to reflect that this county with it's great tradition of giving it all, win, lose, or draw, are happy with a loss, playing defensively, is big change over the years.
It may be that I am like the child in the Emperor's new clothes analogy, but that is my view. I will be in Navan on Sunday supporting Offaly, and hope give their all in the game, and regardless of the result, I am proud to can say we gave everything.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by Lone Shark » Fri May 10, 2019 12:30 pm

Geansai Gorm wrote:Harnassing them to avoid a beating is not my view on football, that's all.
And that's fine, it's a legitimate view. There's no exact science on this, but that's all the more reason why I just tend to bristle at the notion that it's never the right thing to do to look at the players at your disposal and to think that "this team is never going to beat an elite side 2-17 to 1-17, but we might just beat them 1-6 to 0-8".

I think we can agree on this much - going out to teach a club U-13 team how to play defensive tactics instead of focussing on kicking with both feet, handpassing with two hands, high catching, tackling and all the rest of it, is clearly wrong. At the other end of the scale, a senior intercounty team shouldn't need any work on those skills, so it should be about tactical preparation, high level fitness and conditioning, and all the add ons. Everything else is somewhere in between those two extremes, and I would feel that intercounty minor should be a lot closer to the latter than the former - if it's not, the clubs of the county have a lot to answer for.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by Lone Shark » Fri May 10, 2019 12:51 pm

SearingDrive wrote:Just a few thoughts on Wednesday night's game. I was not there, so I rely on Kevin Corrigan's report from Navan. The sense I got from his article was that Offaly could have won that game, if they had adopted a more attacking approach to the game.
This is entirely possible. It's equally possible that by adopting a more attacking approach might have led to Meath being out of sight after 45 minutes. We can never know this, all we do know is that they took the approach they did, and going into the last few minutes they were one score away from one of the best teams in Ireland, on their home ground.
SearingDrive wrote:Your first line of defence is your forward line, if they pressurise their opponents, and are scoring, this limits the opposition attacking your goal. I don't like the modern, defensive boring football that is being played nowadays, and I suspect a lot of people feel the same way. No matter how it is portrayed as championship football, it is not very creative or easy to look at.
Your point about forwards pressurising is correct, however it's surely obvious that pressurising opponents in 2500 square metres of space, i.e. with one player in every 160 square metres, is a hell of a lot easier than trying to do that across three times the same area. If you play the whole field when the opposition have the ball, that's one player in every 500 square metres. Miss one tackle, which is easy done in that amount of space, and instantly you've put your backline under pressure.

And you're right, it's not as much fun to look at as long kicks into contested possessions - but if that's the type of game we as GAA members want to see, it's up to us to legislate for it by changing the rules, most likely by going to 13-a-side, or by legislating for a rugby-style tackle so managers don't need to give their backs so much help. It's not up to individual managers to please spectators, at the expense of their own team.
SearingDrive wrote: Meath scored 8 points, so they may not be world beaters, perhaps if Offaly had pushed it they might perhaps have won.
Perhaps. But as I pointed out above, perhaps it would have been 3-20 to 1-11, and all those players who chose not to come in would be vindicated in their decision and in some cases would share those feelings with those who did go in. For their part, the players who did put the effort in would feel that they're a world away from where they need to be, so it's not worth making the effort. If you're dealing in hypotheticals, it's not fair to present one side of the coin and ignore the other.
SearingDrive wrote:I would rather see a team entertain, than bore me, and to reflect that this county with it's great tradition of giving it all, win, lose, or draw, are happy with a loss, playing defensively, is big change over the years.
It may be that I am like the child in the Emperor's new clothes analogy, but that is my view. I will be in Navan on Sunday supporting Offaly, and hope give their all in the game, and regardless of the result, I am proud to can say we gave everything.
I would not be entertained at the thought of an Offaly manager, senior or minor, prioritising the enjoyment of supporters over what he or she felt was best suited to the players at their disposal.

No county has a long standing tradition of playing defensively, so it's a misnomer to say that Offaly are unusual in that regard. When Meath played with just two inside forwards in the 1990's, that was revolutionary. And I'm sure the players and management would resent the implication that it's only by pouring forward that you're "giving it all". I would argue that trying to keep your concentration on a defensive job and still find the energy to get forward and support your isolated attackers is far more demanding than either playing catch and kick, or else just going on solo runs with the ball at every opportunity.

And at the risk of being over the top, I'd say it's probably bordering on insulting to say that this team or anyone involved with them is "happy with a loss". They went out to win the game, they had a vision of how it was going to happen, and it didn't work out, they fell narrowly short. There is no way they'd be happy with it, but that doesn't change the fact that they came closer than form, track record and personnel available suggested they would.

On Sunday, I would suggest that the Offaly team on the field won't play defensively, simply because that doesn't suit them. In contrast to that minor group, that's not a team that can win 1-6 to 0-8 - in fact if they are going to win, I would suggest that 2-17 to 1-17 is exactly the type of scoreline that they want. Horses for courses and all that.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Offaly Minor Football Team Named

Post by SearingDrive » Fri May 10, 2019 4:05 pm

Lone Shark has presented well argued points as he normally does.
We agree on some points, but where we differ is on the approach to championship football in 2019.

I got the feeling from the comments posted, that it was preferable to lose by 3 points, than be routed. I don't accept the modern approach to football, 13 men behind the ball engaged in endless lateral passing, rather than push forward and try for a score. It is a turn off,usually breaks down, and supporters find it tiresome to watch. If you have 6 forwards in the opposition half, you are more likely to score, than have 1 or 2 players isolated, with little support, outnumbered by the opposing
There are 6 defenders whose job is to contain the opposition attack. A defence as crowded as a supermarket checkout does nothing for me.
It is not impossible to be entertaining, while adopting a positive approach in football games. I never suggested that teams do not go out to win, just the tactics are hard to watch, and a more adventurous approach could yield dividends.
I hope maybe in vain, that the current defensive style of football nowadays, is replaced by a more attacking style.
Good luck to John Maughan and his team on Sunday.

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