Joe McDonagh cup

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
uibhfhaili
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by uibhfhaili » Sat Jun 08, 2019 5:48 pm

Lone Shark wrote:The Kerry anomaly pointed out by llkj above is a disgrace, and it always amazes me that it doesn't get more air time. Waterford are currently in freefall, they've given up on their manager entirely, and while they would still be favourites to beat Carlow in a one off game, I would suggest that Carlow wouldn't be entirely without hope - and surely they should be entitled to that chance to prove that they are not the worst team out of the top ten.

In the longer term, the system means that if Waterford (or any other Munster county) were to go into freefall as Offaly have done, they would be insulated into the top tier for as long as Kerry fail to win the Joe McDonagh Cup, and that might never happen.

I genuinely don't understand why it it tolerated, other than I assume Kerry are quite happy with the situation themselves, it ensures that there's no danger of hurling flying too high and interfering with football.
The fact that Kerry havent fielded at minor/U21 in Munster for years and yet still play the 2nd tier at adult is the real anomaly here. With the minor round robin in Munster they have the option of playing 5 of the top hurling sides at minor avery season which would surely be in the best longterm development but the Kerry CCB just aren't interested in putting in the effort. It would be a disgrace if a county with that attitude ended up playing in the top tier.

GAHMAD
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by GAHMAD » Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:32 pm

Only one way to ensure that Kerry end up where they belong now. Offaly will have had a chance to have a look at how Laois exploited them today and see what we can do and also how we can shut things down defensively too which will be vital.
Kerry scored 1-21 which is a decent score against Laois.

llkj
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by llkj » Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:14 pm

GAHMAD wrote:Only one way to ensure that Kerry end up where they belong now. Offaly will have had a chance to have a look at how Laois exploited them today and see what we can do and also how we can shut things down defensively too which will be vital.
Kerry scored 1-21 which is a decent score against Laois.
Assuming they were in Kerry today. Watched Gaanow and was pretty shocked to see one of our selectors and main coach commentating up in Antrim. You would have thought full focus is required by everyone for a few weeks.

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bracknaghboy
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by bracknaghboy » Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:47 pm

llkj wrote:Assuming they were in Kerry today. Watched Gaanow and was pretty shocked to see one of our selectors and main coach commentating up in Antrim. You would have thought full focus is required by everyone for a few weeks.
Couldn't agree more. That same individual spends a lot of time talking about what needs to be done, whats wrong and how unprofessional set ups are within the county and here he is after been given the opportunity to do something useful by saving the countys McDonagh status and rather than plotting Kerrys downfall from Tralee he is commentating up at an Antrim game. Shows a lack of real commitment to the cause and is very disappointing but not inconsistent with whats going on in the county in general when it comes to hurling.

feirmeoir
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by feirmeoir » Sat Jun 08, 2019 10:42 pm

if Offaly beat kerry are they guaranteed to stay up

GAHMAD
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by GAHMAD » Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:09 pm

He might have been pre contracted to do the commentary.

But like has been said , this was a genuine chance to watch Kerry up close, playing Laois and looking at how they could be exploited.
If said guys are serious about doing a job they should have been in Tralee and plotting from tomorrow. It smacks of a level of preparation that we are guilty of in hurling, sure we'll just impose our game on them. All well and good if you are Kilkenny.

I would expect that the rest of the management team are on their way back from Kerry with information in hand?

But either way , the time for talking is done and only a full blooded but clever hurling display will defeat Kerry down there.

Best of luck to the players and Joachim next weekend.

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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by GAHMAD » Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:13 pm

Fair dues to Laois & Westmeath with the results achieved seeing them through to the final.

Be interesting final when is played.

Keyser Soze
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by Keyser Soze » Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:21 pm

llkj wrote:
GAHMAD wrote:Only one way to ensure that Kerry end up where they belong now. Offaly will have had a chance to have a look at how Laois exploited them today and see what we can do and also how we can shut things down defensively too which will be vital.
Kerry scored 1-21 which is a decent score against Laois.
Assuming they were in Kerry today. Watched Gaanow and was pretty shocked to see one of our selectors and main coach commentating up in Antrim. You would have thought full focus is required by everyone for a few weeks.
Brian Carroll & who??

LooseCannon
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by LooseCannon » Sun Jun 09, 2019 1:08 am

Keyser Soze wrote:
llkj wrote:
GAHMAD wrote:Only one way to ensure that Kerry end up where they belong now. Offaly will have had a chance to have a look at how Laois exploited them today and see what we can do and also how we can shut things down defensively too which will be vital.
Kerry scored 1-21 which is a decent score against Laois.
Assuming they were in Kerry today. Watched Gaanow and was pretty shocked to see one of our selectors and main coach commentating up in Antrim. You would have thought full focus is required by everyone for a few weeks.
Brian Carroll & who??
I believe GAHMAD means that he’s serving as a coach and selector.
"The greatest one in a row in history."

Plain of the Herbs
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Tralee - Relief or Requiem?

Post by Plain of the Herbs » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:18 pm

I’m going to go against popular opinion here. I expect a big Offaly performance and I expect Offaly to win. Offaly hurled with spirit against Antrim, admittedly lost their way during the second half when McManus, Molloy and McNaughton got a run on them, but Offaly had real momentum during stoppage time before falling just short.

Several changes worked too. Cillian Kiely did well in defence, Aidan Treacy did well when at midfield in the first half, Peter Geraghty was lively in attack, while Kevin Dunne, David Nally and David O’Toole did well coming off the bench. This from a management who were in place for 12 days. The intervening two weeks isn’t going to change Offaly hurling, but that time with Martin Bennett’s training and psychological work will be crucial.

Kerry, as befits a Fintan O’Connor managed team, will look to hurl the ball through the lines, attacking full-backs (remember the 2017 St Rynagh’s v Birr quarter-final when the former’s full-back line were doing the scoring under FOC’s guidance). That game requires a high degree of skilful ball play. If Offaly can break that down as Laois did, the visitors will be in business.

O’Leary and Kelly are Kerry’s principal puckout targets. But the pressure is all on Kerry – seven days ago they were dreaming of Croke Park – who have seven days to recalibrate and focus on a relegation play off. And they are at home. Still, if last week’s Laois game is anything to go by, Austin Stack Park is no Galatasaray.

Antrim took the southerners for three goals, Laois scored five. Offaly will probably need four goals to win. With Oisín Kelly, Shane Dooley and Kevin Connolly close to goal with Joseph Bergin 30 yards further out, that's absolutely do-able.

Written off within their own county where all you hear is that Nick Rackard standard is where they belong; ridiculed nationwide where few will mourn their passing. Offaly had their first stroke of good fortune this year when Laois won in Tralee and Westmeath won in Dunloy. Buoyed by that boost there’s one big performance in this Offaly team. That will be on Saturday. Offaly to win, something like 4-16 to 1-20.


While I’m at it, admission for adults again is €10, OAPs and students are €5 while juveniles are free, as it is for all JMcD group games.
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

llkj
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Re: Tralee - Relief or Requiem?

Post by llkj » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:37 am

Plain of the Herbs wrote: But the pressure is all on Kerry – seven days ago they were dreaming of Croke Park – who have seven days to recalibrate and focus on a relegation play off. And they are at home.

Written off within their own county where all you hear is that Nick Rackard standard is where they belong; ridiculed nationwide where few will mourn their passing.

While I’m at it, admission for adults again is €10, OAPs and students are €5 while juveniles are free, as it is for all JMcD group games.
I agree with a lot of what you said and I also expect Offaly to win this weekend. But come on, you surely can't say with a straight face that all of the pressure is on Kerry. You are sounding a little like a cute Kerry hoor the week before a munster football final, saying that Cork are favourites, before Kerry go and beat them by 15 points.

Of course there is massive pressure on Offaly. No point in trying to deny that. Embrace it. We all know that it would be a disaster if we went back to back with relegations. Make that the challenge to the players and present this as their opportunity. It might be the best thing that they do for their County!

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Re: Tralee - Relief or Requiem?

Post by Plain of the Herbs » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:09 am

Fair enough. There is massive pressure on Offaly, and I agree that should be embraced. But I think it is worth pointing out that Kerry are under pressure too.

I'll be honest, I was taken aback by the negativity on the other thread. It's probably a GAA thing - 'aah, ye won't win that, what are ye bothering for?', and if you win you're told 'aah, that'll be as far as ye go'. It'd drive you cracked. I'd be an optimistic person anyway and I know Joachim and Martin Bennett are promoting a spirit of positivity, which is great.

As for the Cork/Kerry thing. Well, there was a time when Offaly were up there with those two counties for putting a spin on things, talking up the opposition, playing down their own chances and then giving an exhibition of hurling or football, or being crafty with a dummy team or talking up niggling injuries. That's something the county has lost this century. Now we are seen as biffos (and I find that phrase offensive, some glory in it, but we all know it is intended as being offensive) who are going to make a balls of things no matter what.
llkj wrote:
Plain of the Herbs wrote: But the pressure is all on Kerry – seven days ago they were dreaming of Croke Park – who have seven days to recalibrate and focus on a relegation play off. And they are at home.

Written off within their own county where all you hear is that Nick Rackard standard is where they belong; ridiculed nationwide where few will mourn their passing.

While I’m at it, admission for adults again is €10, OAPs and students are €5 while juveniles are free, as it is for all JMcD group games.
I agree with a lot of what you said and I also expect Offaly to win this weekend. But come on, you surely can't say with a straight face that all of the pressure is on Kerry. You are sounding a little like a cute Kerry hoor the week before a munster football final, saying that Cork are favourites, before Kerry go and beat them by 15 points.

Of course there is massive pressure on Offaly. No point in trying to deny that. Embrace it. We all know that it would be a disaster if we went back to back with relegations. Make that the challenge to the players and present this as their opportunity. It might be the best thing that they do for their County!
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by Fairplayalways » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:43 pm

Jaysus isnt it hard to believe we were reigning AI champions this time 20 years ago, our rot was sort of underway in ways...good beatings in Leinster Finals 1998/99/00 and then the the AI of 2000, we had a few glimpses of recovery in the years just after but honestly we knew it was always a false dawn... we are now where we are...had to work today so couldnt make the game but listened to it on R3 and they died trying today...I dont think they would have done any better (I actually dont think they would have done better and would have been beaten by more if Kevin Martin was still in charge, and thats not personal against Kevin, there was just no spark in them, Joachim, regardless of how he got the job, had a bit of fight in them, we were clinging to the radio for the first time in a long time, be it still defeat but, while Kerry were apparently the better team, Offaly gave it a go..sending off so early didnt help their cause and people will question a few of refs decisions, but we lost a man early, and Kerry keeper done excellently to save Shane Dooleys penalty, and at the end of the day, they are two factors that probably cost us the game (and a few woeful wides but Kerry shot some too I suppose)..pity but we have to hand it to these lads for going in game after game and things as they are...its no fault of theirs we have gone so low...just may sit down now (yes, again!) and see where we go from here at every level of intercounty hurling...winning Leinster finals at underage and schools level by beating teams from the so called weaker counties has masked alot of our problems too...anyway...lets see where we go..

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bracknaghboy
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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by bracknaghboy » Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:11 pm

Few have commented on the game itself. The year has been horrendous for the players and things weren't helped in the lead up to this crunch game. Bringing in players who hadn't been involved all year at the expense of some who were(I've seen this at all levels of GAA and never has it gone down well and it appears this was no exception).
Reports that Joe Bergins exclusion may have been linked to the above.....well I'm sure others are much more in the know about this so I'll say no more. Then 24hrs before the game a prominent figure begins abusing management on social media which generated a presumably intended media storm. He may well have been correct in some of his points but how the hell putting it out there before a game like this was in the best interests of the players on the pitch or Offaly hurling is truly beyond me.

Anyways the game started brightly and Offaly race into a 4 point lead until the red card. Lack of discipline has been a poison running through the hurlers for a number of years now, so many games that finish with 14 men and lads needlessly ruled out for future games as a consequence. Then a penalty miss a few mins later and the game was up really after that. Offalys crude hit and hope plan was laid bare and Kerry easily countered it with the spare man before working their short passing game around the pitch at will. The makeshift Offaly outfit were always going to struggle. Dooleys 2nd half goal gave brief hope but Kerry were always in control. It looked all over the shop really, the way the team was patched together, the substitutes made, the reluctance to withdraw certain players etc. But look Joachim and the lads were called in to save Offaly from the drop and they had a right good go at it so we can't be too hard on them.

Joachim is refreshingly honest. He's right, nobody died and the sun will rise again the morning. We appear to have no end of people ranging from journalists, sports editors, commentators, analysts etc. etc. etc. that know whats wrong and what needs to be done. Lets stop complaining (that means us all) and getting working. Put the candidates up at the convention this years and put the new county board in place and start from there, it won't be easy but there enough people who know what needs to be done with it. Just get on with it.

On a funny note I had wondered how long after the game it would take Greenairfield to call for Byrnes head.....would he wait a day or maybe two? Oh no sir it looks like he waited all of 90mins! Its the little things that put a smile on the face with all thats going on. Keep the heads up we as a county have nothing to be ashamed of.

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Re: Joe McDonagh cup

Post by greenairfield » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:53 am

Bracknagh boy great post ..we will leave Tommy there in fairness to him hes doing a great job..
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