NHL Division 1B 2019

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
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Bord na Mona man
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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by Bord na Mona man » Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:33 pm

Commiserations to all involved. At some point we were going to eventually fall through this particular trap door.

Most of us have seen the problems which are about 25 years in the making. No use in lashing into the current group who I'm sure are feeling very deflated right now.

Offaly hurling can restore itself at the top table in a few years. It won't be easy but it certainly isn't impossible.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by allstar2010 » Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:56 pm

Congrats to Carlow. Well deserved and no one can have any complaints. How many clubs are they actually pulling players from? Great achievement by them to be competing at this level. They have a manager that has been over Fitzgibbon cup teams for years and knows what’s needed in the modern game and brought that experience to Carlow and fair play to them. Also, Westmeath won today so they’re after passing us out as well. Depressing stuff, we’re now 3rd ranked of the 3 Midland counties. Jesus.

Devastated for those players, no doubt they’ve been putting in a huge effort since Oct/Nov with little or no reward. Can’t be easy to take. Go back to their clubs now and enjoy a few weeks training with their clubs and heads up and give the Joe McDonagh cup a right rattle.

No current player is responsible for the state were in and none of them deserve to take any blame for this relegation. So many others need to take a long hard look at themselves. County Board, clubs, ex-players... etc. Do we need a separate hurling board??

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by LooseCannon » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:30 pm

Disappointing. I’m not going to criticise anyone unlike certain individuals on Facebook comments, who I doubt are even payed up members of their own clubs. Firing abuse at players who are giving their all, no doubt is despicable. A good belt of an ash plant would do them (verbal abusers) the world of good. That is all.
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llkj
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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by llkj » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:33 pm

I believe there are 10 clubs in Carlow that play adult hurling. In Offaly that number is 20.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by LooseCannon » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:44 pm

llkj wrote:I believe there are 10 clubs in Carlow that play adult hurling. In Offaly that number is 20.
Ballyskenagh/Killavilla
Shinrone
Coolderry
Carrig and Riverstown
Seir Kieran
Crinkill
Drumcullen
Birr
St Rynagh’s
Lusmagh
Belmont
Brosna Gaels
Clara
Ballinamere
KK
Shamrocks
Tullamore
Kinnitty
Clodiagh Gaels
Gracefield
Think that’s 19, not nitpicking from above, just listing them.
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old yellar
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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by old yellar » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:51 pm

Hi all. it was a huge battle today and as a carlow man i m hugely relieved to have got over the line. As a man with links to some of the offaly players/living there for a dozen years and to see them all wanting to do nothing only wear an offaly jersey from 12/13 years of age, it was hard to see them so deflated at the end. I know what they have given all the way up, the proud parents/families in the background and hurling put first. So it was a mixed day.
I think we sometimes read too much into what happens in sport. On any given day, theres not a puck of a ball between about 6 teams at our level. I cant see us staying up where we are for that long as we ve a big tail on our talent in the younger ages - ye ve given us some beatings. Good chaps but just not at that level. Things go in cycles and ye had some unbelievable years with great success. We never had that until the last number of years with success at our own level - christy ring, joe mcdonagh, league. So getting up into that top tier is huge for us. We hurled wicklow too for years! So what i m saying is, ye ll be back. despite all the rubbish you hear about great work being done here or there, a lot of it comes down to raw latent talent, a bit of luck and sticking with it. Some of our lads have gotten awful clippings at underage. Have been part of squads that couldnt field in intercounty tournaments etc. We re doing nothing special down here anyhow! if anything we re in bother with only 4 clubs playing at senior level now. Someone mentioned about our pick and it is small but we have everyone on board thats upto that standard. So we re going to enjoy what we have at the minute as we ve seen the lean years and realise how fleeting it all can be. We arent holding out much hope for the leinster but we ll give it all and enjoy the days against the big lads. So look at all ye are doing right and support them in any way possible. Ye d think it was the end of the road! Not at all. Just a blip. I hope ye get fully behind the panel. They are giving all they can and bursting their arses to wear the jersey. I think back of the days like 98 and the crowds, the support, the back slapping, the huge celebrations, the scramble for tickets.. and then i looked in the stand today. Where has the support gone? Jesus your county is your county no matter what! Today was a huge day for both counties. We brought what we d normally bring as we ve only a v small pocket to pick from. Maybe i m out of touch!
I dont want to get into detail about the match itself but i thought dooley and bergin stood up with big scores for ye. I think they ll be key for ye winning the joe mcdonagh. How posters on here could question them i dunno. They could have walked well before this year but stuck on again. i hope both men and they rest of the panel get the support they need in the coming weeks and that ye have a big summer ahead.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by old yellar » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:55 pm

llkj wrote:I believe there are 10 clubs in Carlow that play adult hurling. In Offaly that number is 20.
We have 4 senior clubs, 3 other solely intermediate ones, 3 solely junior and one club thats currently only upto u15 level as its not long started.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by Toxicity234 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:01 am

Donal Og a fucking prick...
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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by biffinbanner » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:39 am

why is donal og a fucking prick? he presented the chart and we were 20 years(1980 to 2000) at the top table? what did he say was wrong? we all know the people he was talking about who questioned various managers tactics as we slid slowly down the slide from where we were in 2000 to where we are now. we may have had an exalted opinion that we were going to produce john troys, brian whelehans ,dooleys etc every generation?. my own opinion is that every manger we had since 2000 made maximum use(and of their skill levels) of the players that were available and committed to the jersey. shane dooley and joe bergin are carrying the team for 8/10 years,legends to my thinking both of them .they are now in their 30s...as they say we are where we are.. lets be positive and give kevin martin and his team space and wish them the best of luck in the joe mcdonagh cup.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by Lone Shark » Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:18 am

biffinbanner wrote:why is donal og a fucking prick? he presented the chart and we were 20 years(1980 to 2000) at the top table? what did he say was wrong? we all know the people he was talking about who questioned various managers tactics as we slid slowly down the slide from where we were in 2000 to where we are now. we may have had an exalted opinion that we were going to produce john troys, brian whelehans ,dooleys etc every generation?. my own opinion is that every manger we had since 2000 made maximum use(and of their skill levels) of the players that were available and committed to the jersey. shane dooley and joe bergin are carrying the team for 8/10 years,legends to my thinking both of them .they are now in their 30s...as they say we are where we are.. lets be positive and give kevin martin and his team space and wish them the best of luck in the joe mcdonagh cup.
I've work to do still before going to bed, but today's defeat is eating away at me in a way that none has for quite some time, so I'm going to tackle a few points in no particular order here.

(1) On Donal Óg - he made three key points, one I would agree with, one I'd disagree with, one I'd be somewhere in the middle. Is the population an issue - absolutely. However it's no more of an issue than it is for Westmeath, Carlow or Laois all of which are ahead of us now. Are Offaly back to their "historical mean"? - hell no. We're way worse. Not since WWII have we been outside the top six in Leinster, and by that I mean Leinster, not Leinster plus Galway. In 1950 Kilkenny lost the All Ireland final by a point. 20 months later Offaly lost to Kilkenny by a goal, 2-8 to 3-8 in the Leinster championship. Does anyone think for a minute that we'd get within one goal of any All-Ireland contender team now? Yes the 80's and 90's were an anomaly, but Offaly hurling in the 60's, 70's and 00's was never more than a couple of years away from a really big result against a strong team. Now we're probably five years away from beating Laois again, if everything goes well.

Where Donal Óg is right is that hurling has changed, and Offaly has fought that change rather than went along with it, or better yet, done what small counties have to do - innovated, and led the way.

(2) This is not about kicking players, or management when they're down - but even if we park all the underage issues, all the senior players we don't have, that still doesn't justify what we saw today. Laois have been beating us steadily at minor level for some time, of course they were going to overtake us. That's one thing. Carlow haven't been doing that, and as Old Yellar said, the depth isn't there in Carlow. Their fifth team from ten played in the same Leinster competition as Clara this year, and if those clubs had met, it would have been a close game. Moreover, their best club played Coolderry, and Coolderry beat them well. Today one Coolderry man played for Offaly, eight Mount Leinster men featured for Carlow, albeit three as subs. Of course we have an issue with player development, with coaching, with tactics etc - but in terms of raw material, don't cod ourselves by saying that Carlow have better raw material. They've moulded a better team absolutely, but that's not a long term issue for Offaly, that's a 2019 issue.

(3) Management can take a lot of responsibility for the above. Players need to look at the fact that in the majority of cases, they were outfought on an individual basis today. This is not about blame, or anything like it. Conor Langton came off the bench, all ten stone whatever of him, and he threw himself into a ruck for possession in his first play. He didn't win the ball, but he stopped a Carlow man from winning it. The sliothar broke out to the side, and Shane Dooley got a good possession and a shot out of it, albeit one that hit the post and went wide. That was nothing to do with coaching, or tactics, or anything else - it was just a young player throwing himself into it in a way that too many Offaly players didn't today. I'm not going to blame individuals, but we don't have the skill set to work the ball out of defence - we're just not that good. However we had no choice today, because Carlow utterly dominated our puckout in the second half.

(4) One final simple observation. The wheels were clearly coming off from a long way out, arguably from the midway point in the first half. And yet by the 70th minute, we made ONE non-enforced substitution, Dermot Shortt for Aidan Treacy at half time. Flynn was brought on to replace an injured player, as was Langton. Now I'm not making a case for any one sub here - but we had seven other outfield players on the bench, and not one of them were considered a viable option to replace any of (in my opinion) six outfield players that in my view, were either not having a good day, or were not having a good second half.

The best hurler in the world could have a bad day, and need to be taken off - that's not being personal about it, that's just the nature of sport. That we chose to replace one player only suggests to me that management either does not rate the rest of the panel at all, or management was blind to what was happening out there.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by llkj » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:55 am

LooseCannon wrote:
llkj wrote:I believe there are 10 clubs in Carlow that play adult hurling. In Offaly that number is 20.
Ballyskenagh/Killavilla
Shinrone
Coolderry
Carrig and Riverstown
Seir Kieran
Crinkill
Drumcullen
Birr
St Rynagh’s
Lusmagh
Belmont
Brosna Gaels
Clara
Ballinamere
KK
Shamrocks
Tullamore
Kinnitty
Clodiagh Gaels
Gracefield
Think that’s 19, not nitpicking from above, just listing them.
Pretty sure that your list has 20 teams in it. Interesting that we have lost clubs over the years. I definitely remember Rhode, st Bridgets, edenderry all having teams within the last 20 years. While others have merged together to form one club. Only one we have gained is Brosna Gaels,

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by LooseCannon » Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:21 am

llkj wrote:
LooseCannon wrote:
llkj wrote:I believe there are 10 clubs in Carlow that play adult hurling. In Offaly that number is 20.
Ballyskenagh/Killavilla
Shinrone
Coolderry
Carrig and Riverstown
Seir Kieran
Crinkill
Drumcullen
Birr
St Rynagh’s
Lusmagh
Belmont
Brosna Gaels
Clara
Ballinamere
KK
Shamrocks
Tullamore
Kinnitty
Clodiagh Gaels
Gracefield
Think that’s 19, not nitpicking from above, just listing them.
Pretty sure that your list has 20 teams in it. Interesting that we have lost clubs over the years. I definitely remember Rhode, st Bridgets, edenderry all having teams within the last 20 years. While others have merged together to form one club. Only one we have gained is Brosna Gaels,
Apologies, you’re correct. Daingean and Ballyfore also had teams in the last 25 years.
"The greatest one in a row in history."

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by kingscounty » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:05 am

Take a look at the decline in teams, Edenderry a strong team at junior reaching county finals and a Leinster final few years back and now gone which is a disgrace for a club that originated as a hurling club. Croghan, Rhode, Ballyfore,Geashil, Daingean, all had teams at a time when Offaly were going good. Now I know none of these clubs were a breeding ground for county players but the interest was there the support was there for the county, I know people from these areas still follow hurling but as a young lad in these areas when you don’t see hurling when you don’t grow up going to club games following your local team hurling doesn’t matter then. The one thing I will say I noticed in some areas is when you have a football and hurling team one seems to suffer at the expense of the other, would two separate boards one for hurling one for football help at county level or would it make things even worse!

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by old yellar » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:13 am

I think this could be a good thing for your hurling in the short term. I 've been on this forum a good number of years and it's been nothing only room and gloom and talking about beatings and where we are going etc etc. Being in a lower division might allow us to actually implement a long term plan rather than focusing on not shipping beatings and targeting the likes of us to stay up. It isn't all that bad down there!! Our young players have developed ok in it over the last few years and some of our older lads who hurled the majority of their time in it have made the step up easily. Going back is not the end. I also think it might bring some positivity back when the wins begin to clock up. Imagine currently being a player and listening to talk about being currently way of the pace etc. Can't entice them to want to play. It's not long ago- 2014 or 15 we went up to hurl ye in a Leinster qualifier group game with only 17 for outfield players, so it hasn't been all rosy for us either. Maybe taking the step back will finally allow us to build rather than foresight. There needs to be an appetite from the public too to support the lads etc. If you can tell me that what was there in oconnor park yesterday was the full support of what's behind offaly hurling, well then to my mind, you need to look at that as well. And if the line of "We couldn't be going to tullamore/watch that" is all that's trotted out, well if I was a player I wouldn't be overly worried what the general public think.
On the mlr/coolderry thing, well it's not an age ago that mlr win an intermediate all Ireland and competed in a senior final. They ain't no mugs! Like I said, sport is fical. Had breach not saved the ball near in the second half, or Dooley blasted to the net, or Chris Nolan kick gone outside the post, ye would have 2 years in the top 12 and would be talking about a chance to rebuild and kick on..

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Re: NHL Division 1B 2019

Post by old yellar » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:16 am

Auto correct put us instead of ye in my text.. or maybe it was my heart too!

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