Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Hurlingtothebackbone » Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:32 am

And so its all over the fools that are Offaly's County Board messed up yet again last night and could not see reason with a KK motion to re in state last years management with those in situ this year, this would have meant you would have had ample bodies in place to work with and coach our young stars. But the bully boy's and dictators that are Offaly's County board got there way, all common sense and reason went out the window. Master stoke was pulled yet again (by the most cunning man on the board) calling for a secret ballot, clubs get what they deserve sending individual's to meetings that have not a clue what is going on. A concerned parent got a call after the meeting last night to update him that same parent told me this morning on the way to work as a county we are now in disaster land. He was in Kilkenny last Sunday with his lad for a challenge v Kilkenny U17's, 47 players travelled 31 togged for the challenge, Kilkenny had 24 U17s togged we had a mix of U16s and U17s. Offaly started 2 players with only one training done, they started 5 u16s ahead of U17s who were training since they went back, some lads got 10mins some got the hour and some got no game time. Result 6 to 8 U17s walked away sour and are not going back- my buddies lad been one of them and he was a regular starter in 2014 2015 and 2016 . He also told me that 4 of last years managements were present watching the game a bit of an irony when Offaly had 3 mentors to manage 47 lads. Kilkenny on the other hand had 5 mentors and two medical staff to manage 24 and Offaly CB call this progress what a load of b..........................
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Cmon Offaly » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:11 am

It beggers belief the manner in which the county board has handled the whole affair, if what Hurlingtothebackbone says is true about a game in Kilkenny last weekend we are in Disaster land. Martin Cashen coming in as the new Coaching Officer had a brilliant opportunity to put his stamp on the position and sort this out very quickly but instead towed the line with the rest of them and failed to be his own man. It just shows the mentality of the top table and those involved with them. the KK motion sounded like a good solution to the whole mess but once again "we will look after our own" mentality came into play with the county board. It must be very frustrating for last years mentors especially the 2 guys from Shinrone and KK who have fought this for the last 3 months and seemingly only for Brian Gavin and Fergal McKeown got very little backing from other clubs which is a disgrace really. If the same thing happened with the football squads would they all have stayed so quiet. Where to now with this??, is that it??. Are the county board going to allow 2 squads completely fall apart just to try a prove a point to KK and Shinrone, don't forget this U 16 squad who apparently have no work done on their own yet are our county minor team next year. Next years minor management will be interesting that's if it hasn't been sorted out already.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby llkj » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:48 pm

Hurlingtothebackbone wrote:And so its all over the fools that are Offaly's County Board messed up yet again last night and could not see reason with a KK motion to re in state last years management with those in situ this year, this would have meant you would have had ample bodies in place to work with and coach our young stars. But the bully boy's and dictators that are Offaly's County board got there way, all common sense and reason went out the window. Master stoke was pulled yet again (by the most cunning man on the board) calling for a secret ballot, clubs get what they deserve sending individual's to meetings that have not a clue what is going on. A concerned parent got a call after the meeting last night to update him that same parent told me this morning on the way to work as a county we are now in disaster land. He was in Kilkenny last Sunday with his lad for a challenge v Kilkenny U17's, 47 players travelled 31 togged for the challenge, Kilkenny had 24 U17s togged we had a mix of U16s and U17s. Offaly started 2 players with only one training done, they started 5 u16s ahead of U17s who were training since they went back, some lads got 10mins some got the hour and some got no game time. Result 6 to 8 U17s walked away sour and are not going back- my buddies lad been one of them and he was a regular starter in 2014 2015 and 2016 . He also told me that 4 of last years managements were present watching the game a bit of an irony when Offaly had 3 mentors to manage 47 lads. Kilkenny on the other hand had 5 mentors and two medical staff to manage 24 and Offaly CB call this progress what a load of b..........................


It seems that not much has changed since my time, where I experienced a very similar poor experience within the County setup. I could tell you 10 stories, here is one:

I was u17 and called into the county minor squad. Trained for 5 weeks with 100% attendance record. We went down to Laois to play them in a challenge game. We had 2 squads with the plan to play 2 games against Laois at different venues - A and B games, with one game starting after the other.To cut a long story short, I spent my entire Sunday (something like leaving my house at 9am and getting home at 8pm that evening) to get about a 2 min run out with the B team, in a position on the field that I had never played in before, while all the management team had already left for the other venue by the time I got on the field (maybe the bus driver made the call to put me on the team.) We then had to go and watch the A team play, wait around for them to change, get the bus to get food, drive back to Birr and then get home. 11 hours, for 2 mins, with nobody accessing performance!

I made a conscious decision after that experience to not commit my time to the county minor team any further that year. I was doing my Leaving Cert and had more things to occupy my time. I most certainly would have stayed if I thought the setup was worth my time and I was developing - but it completely turned me off.

I'm sure that some people would say that they would do anything to play for the county and it was a sign that I wasn't committed enough or not up to it. My point is that poor organisation like that was a loss for everyone - the county lost a player and I lost the ability to play with the county, which was my dream.

Years on, we are still losing out.... And then we say - "ah, the young lads just aren't coming through, or they are not committed." Really?
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Roverrover » Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:28 pm

Sounds like an absolute shambles. Speaking of minor teams how are our lads set for Saturday? I didn't realise they were playing Championship this soon until I picked up the Tribune today. Has the development squad issues impacted on there preparations?
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Truth as i see it » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:11 pm

Roverrover wrote:Sounds like an absolute shambles. Speaking of minor teams how are our lads set for Saturday? I didn't realise they were playing Championship this soon until I picked up the Tribune today. Has the development squad issues impacted on there preparations?


The definition of madness? Wash, Rinse, Repeat.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Toxicity234 » Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:59 pm

I've been trying to stay out of this.
But someone might give up an update or lack of one on the following Questions.

Plain of the Herbs wrote a few months ago the following:

The Chairman promised answers to the seven questions following serious consideration

The questions were (I'm paraphrasing, too much typing) -
1. Asking for an update on the appointment of U14, U15, U16 and U17 development squad managements.
2. Asking for the rational behind merging the U16 and U17 squads, as highlighted by Cmon Offaly here last week.
3. Asking why members of successful 2016 underage managements have been sacked.
4. Asked why no members of the hurling implementation committee had been brought onto the coaching and games committee, something that was promised by the Board.
5. What makes the recommendations of the hurling implementation committee so credible when none of them paid any attention to the U15 team last year, and only one of them attended a single U16 event last year.
6. Why did the board spend €150 per head for the now sacked managements to attend Award 2 courses when the intention was to sack them anyway.
7. Asking two 'yes or no' questions to each of the top table - "are you or have you been aware of this?" and "do you believe this is in the best interests of underage hurling in this county?"
“Common sense is not so common.”
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Hurlingtothebackbone » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:36 pm

Was at the hurling Pathway launch tonight as a spectator not a club invitee and to listen to the irony when Martin Fogarty the National Director of hurling spoke just shows how thick stupid and down right disgraceful this whole situation is. All members of management in Offaly County Board are a joke to stand over the sacking of excellent coaches who seem to have formed a special bond with the players and without doubt were moving in the right direction. He told all present of how you get a parent involved give them a job carrying a water bottle night one then get them to help out with a drill or two the the next night and before long you will have them involved with the team and you might get them involved with the development squads down the road. The national Director of Hurling has no issue with parents been involved with Development squads but Offaly County Board has. Oh no they had they used the father son card as a conflict issue / excuse to sack two management teams but then went on to appoint parents at U14 and U15 two nights later according to reports from Tuesday nights Board Meeting. Coaching and games and Offaly County Board are speaking out of both sides of there mouth. The destruction of underage hurling in this County will be Tom Burns legacy.
As for the Hurling Pathway and what a player should be doing at 8 10 12 and so on ....most of the more successful clubs are light years ahead of the bit I flicked through tonight,
I wonder is the National Director of hurling aware of what Tom Byrne etal have presided over for the last 2+ months and what he would say to the sacking of committed mentors who had a genuine interest in these young lads development and were committed to the cause of underage Hurling in Offaly.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Plain of the Herbs » Fri Apr 07, 2017 6:27 pm

The Development Squad issues shouldn't have a direct impact on this year's Minors, as this year's Minor management has been in place for some time now.
Roverrover wrote:Sounds like an absolute shambles. Speaking of minor teams how are our lads set for Saturday? I didn't realise they were playing Championship this soon until I picked up the Tribune today. Has the development squad issues impacted on there preparations?
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby private joker » Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:55 pm

Big defeat in the minor. Laois 2-22 to 14 points. I was under the impression this was a very good minor. Obviously not going by this result
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Humiliation once again

Postby Plain of the Herbs » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:59 pm

For the avoidance of doubt, this is not an assessment of the Minor class of 2017. It probably isn’t an assessment of the team management either. Rather, it is an incitement of the Offaly hurling development system that led to today’s humiliation.


We’ve been here before. Indeed, we come here at least once a year. Offaly underage team are developed merely to fulfil a fixture and come up against a team who have prepared to be the best that they can be. There only ever is one outcome. Humiliation once again.

The first striking aspect regarding today is that Offaly wore white jerseys. GAA is notorious for teams stubbornly wearing their first choice colours despite the most obvious clash of colours. Now, Offaly can wear red for all I care and wearing white doesn’t bother me, but what I want to know is – when were the players informed? As part of their mental preparation, each individual will have been visualising blue and white facing green, white and gold. Well and good if the team were informed during the week, but it’s more like some fella wearing top boots and a flat cap opened a bag of white jerseys in the dressing room shortly after 2.30pm today. Would Kilkenny have worn white? Or Tipperary? Come to think of it, would Wicklow, or Carlow have done that without warning?

Offaly are playing Kildare next week, so wearing white will not be an option.

Second contrast was the respective body shapes. The muscle mass of several Offaly hurlers were particularly underdeveloped when compared to that of Leix. Strength (whatever about conditioning) was particularly underdeveloped. That core strength is required to contest for possession (in the air and on the ground), to tackle the opposition to effect turnovers, and to break tackles in a bid to retain possession and create scoring chances. Leix also targeted Offaly in the air, and did a good drill in the warmup, practicing aerial fetching under pressure.

Now I know there was a lot of S&C work done with Emmett Egan in Athlone RTC last year, but Leix (and probably everyone else, including Kildare) have been doing this for a number of years now, and so it will take time for the benefits to accrue. Thing is, there is a school of thought out there that S&C is only for those who can’t hurl, and that the time being spent on S&C should be spent on practicing the skills. The same opponents of S&C would probably tell you players shouldn’t get track suits and other gear either because, God help us, they’d wear their gear with pride when out and about.

To give credit, Offaly’s ball work, their touch, the flicks, was superior to the opposition. Great! Today shows that gets you to within 14 points of Leix.

Always interesting to see how far your opposition will go in the championship. I wasn’t impressed with Leix. Now, they had a plan – there was a nippy centre half-forward whose job it was to drag Barry Kealey out of the centre. He did that, but Leix never really exploited the spaces through the centre of the Offaly defence. Had they done so, they could have scored much much more.

Today, Offaly sent a Minor team to Portlaoise to fulfil a fixture. Nothing more. The Minor hurlers will have dreamed of representing their county with pride, maybe of reaching a Leinster final or of hurling live on television. Instead, the outcome was a humiliation. Looking back in time, successful teams (whether club or county) have always been the teams who were the best prepared, while those who exited at the first hurdle were the ones whose preparation was completely insufficient.

That will always be the case. And hopefully the lads can lift themselves and overcome Kildare next week.
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Hurlingtothebackbone » Sun Apr 09, 2017 1:38 pm

Let it be known there was a big effort put in by elements within coaching and games from late last year and early in this year to remove this minor management team and the management team were well aware of it which in itself had to undermine their standing with the minor squad. The world and its mother knew what was going on but C&G did not get their way with Burn and company thats why Burn and the top table gave in when it came to the sacking of managements of development squads.
Yes Egan from Athlone IT was doing great work with the Minors and the development squads in 2016 but that was 2016. Offaly are doing it all themselves now at underage with no input from Egan (he is running the show at senior level) and a lot of the underage coaches in the County don't believe in strength and conditioning let alone believe in GAA 15 a warm up programme to prevent injury. Offaly appoint people to squads at all ages let them off but never police whats happening. Kilkenny last Sunday with the 17s a prime example no single member of the board or C&G present to witness what happens.
And now I expect it to be less important with the appointment of new mentors at U15 & U14 who do not believe in S&C - expect ground hurling to be preached to these young lads time and time again with the managements additions.
The single biggest skill missing in Offaly hurling today is high fielding or catching of any sort and its a myth that you need a big man to catch a high ball prime example Tommy Walsh Kilkenny.
If Offaly done nothing else only practised that single skill it would bring them on 20% at all age groups.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby private joker » Sun Apr 09, 2017 3:16 pm

It's a pity. The long term effects will last till senior and beyond. Lads will play for offaly but won't put in the full effort required because deep down they know things are quite simply not been done right. I know one lad on the team. Good player. But he knows the storey. And is not bothered to put the time in, as he feels the collective effort from the panel, mgt and county board is not been put in. Very disillusioned and only a young lad. By the time he's ready for senior he'll have had enough and will not be seen in a senior county jersey.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby greenairfield » Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:59 pm

If your house is not in order the county board have to take full blame...delighted with the result as it shows up what is really going on at the moment for Offaly underage.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Cmon Offaly » Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:45 pm

Brian Gavin gave a very frank and honest interview to Will O Callaghan on Radio 3 today ( its up as a podcast in case anybody wants to listen to it)about the whole sorry affair. One big factor missing from all development squads up to minor level is continuity with managements. I am not necessarily talking about an entire management team but if a squad is being handed over to new management there needs to be somebody there that knows the lads. Players will have different issues and need to be approached and handled in different ways, some players can be pulled aside and fucked out of it and they will respond, others will do less for you. players have issues at home or in school and its only with having continuity will managements understand players.

Brian was one of the main supporters of Shinrone and KK in all this and fair play to him for coming out and speaking so openly about it, most clubs wouldn't allow their chairman speak so openly dare the upset somebody on the top table. Therein lies another problem with clubs in Offaly, a lot of clubs send in the wrong people as county board delegates, most sit there with their arms folded and say nothing. Until clubs send in people who are willing to speak up and not be afraid of upsetting the top table the top table will continue to do what the want!!

I assume this whole sorry affair is now done with or do Shinrone and KK have any other avenues to take, interesting to also here Will O Callaghan say that only 22 players attended training this morning in Birr and that the parents have been requesting a meeting with the management and C & G for the last 9 weeks and havent received it, its bad enough what the did to the managements but they seem to be giving the 2 fingers to the parents now as well.
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Re: Hurling development squads [Split from Walsh Cup]

Postby Hurlingtothebackbone » Sun Apr 09, 2017 9:46 pm

Just listened to B Gavins interview it is honest and open, would like to think as a County we can move on from this whole sorry affair but untill the real truth comes out it dosent seem possible as I said during the week my buddy said his young fella wasnt going back and he didnt train Thursday or today thats some loss to Offaly GAA if his mind cant be changed. How many more like him will we have?
Wouldnt it be great if W O Callaghan done an interview with some of last years managements or all of them or better still with some of the players or even some parents to see what the real truth of the matter is. We are not been told the whole story. Are we looking at the annointing of next years minor management and was that the real reason why managements got the door. Is it a case of a nother civil servant getting the job a case of looking after one of their own. After all 90% of the top table in offaly are civil servants so is that the real agenda??????????????????????????????????????.
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