Laois v Offaly – Leinster Hurling Quarter Final 7th June

[Sharp Eye]

Last autumn Padraig Boland, chairman of the Offaly Co Board undertook to personally contact each player who had left the Offaly Senior Hurling Panel in 2014. I trust that these contacts have taken place. I hope that the chairman will also contact every player who left the Offaly Senior Hurling Panel in 2015. There must be a number of reasons as to why so many players have left the Offaly Senior Hurling Panel in the past two years. It is strange that Kilcormac/Killoughey who are regarded as being among the top 3 club senior teams in Ireland only have 2 players on the Offaly Panel. Offaly needs its best 25 players on the Offaly Senior Hurling Panel. If players have issues, they must be addressed by the chairman of the County Board as soon as possible.

[ah lethimoutwithit]

Lord Jayz!!!!
Sharp Eye, how many times is the question being asked about KK!

Re KK,
Ciaran Slevin has been there, good lad but did not deliver
The Geraghty's walked, don't know the reason but they walked, are they any better than the rest, who knows? We'll never know if the've taken the decision to leave the squad.
Kevin Grogan & Brian Leonard, fairly sure they were asked in over the years but did not want to commit.
Conor Mahon , away travelling, but is he much better than who is there? Good option to have though, so maybe next year.
Damien Gilmartin, left the panel was it this year or last, definitely one with a case to have been involved more and should have gotten more of a chance.
Conor Slevin, on panel, but not better than Dempsey.

Healions, yes , effective during the winter and spring but for summer hurling at county level,...I don't know, but Ger was really the only one involved.

One could say without question that the hardest done by was probably Danny Owens.

But lets not get carried away with the fact that there are a whole pile of KK players not being considered. A lot of the players above are as good as those on the panel but there are reasons as to they they are not there at the moment.

[Killeighman]

Just saw there that Damien Fox has left the Offaly management team

[allstar2010]

In fairness to sharp eye I think he was just pointing out that we don't have our best players on the panel for one reason or another. I don't think Danny Owens would be the answer to our managerial problems either.

I remember hearing a few years back that Francis Forde was well thought of by the players when he was involved under Baker. Why isn't he given a chance maybe and let him build a management team around him, someone with modern ideas on how the game is played is what's needed and hopefully the players will row in behind him. I suppose the county final collapse last year with rynaghs could be the one blotch on his cv that would go against him.

Would we be able to tempt the two guys that looked after the Clare u21's for the last few years, probably not. But it would be worth trying.

Regardless, the next manager of the senior team is probably not the most important thing right now. Without sounding sexist, there is probably a very high percentage of female teachers in our primary schools and even though the do their best to promote the game with the kids they probably don't have the right coaching or time to do all that is required.

I'd like to see a gaa coach going to the primary school to give coaching courses to a few eager parents from each school and let them take over and maybe a few weeks later get a refresher course.

Another problem which has been ongoing for years, look at our capital town tullamore. Probably a quarter of the population in the county living there if not more and they have done very little at underage in the last 20 years to suggest anything is being done. Edenderry, big population and can't field a fecking junior team. Clara, mediocre junior team. Ferbane, nothing without Belmont. So we only have the small towns of kilcormac, birr and banagher with surrounding areas to promote the game. Ballinamere for it's size seem to be making great progress so why can't others do the same?

[joe bloggs]

On the primary school issue I think the county board should offer a bursary each year to a minor hurler and footballer who qualify to go to college to study primary education. I know when they graduate there is no guarantee they will come back to work in the county straight away or that there would be positions available either, but over time there would be a number of them eventually teaching in our schools. €2000 per student per year would mean an annual cost of €16000 when fully up and running is a fair bit of cash but could be money well spent.

[Lone Shark]

On the primary school issue I think the county board should offer a bursary each year to a minor hurler and footballer who qualify to go to college to study primary education. I know when they graduate there is no guarantee they will come back to work in the county straight away or that there would be positions available either, but over time there would be a number of them eventually teaching in our schools. €2000 per student per year would mean an annual cost of €16000 when fully up and running is a fair bit of cash but could be money well spent.

Honest question - would you choose your lifetime career path on the basis of a €2000 a year grant for four years?

Plenty of GAA players go into teaching anyway because it's fast becoming the only job that an intercounty player can realistically do, however this would be impractical on a world of levels.

[joe bloggs]

No it won't change a lads mind who is interested in medicine etc, but might help to sway a lad between primary and secondary teaching. Primary level attracts very few males. Teaching is probably the ideal job to have in terms of playing at inter county level due to the regular hours and long holidays.
Look at the number of Kilkenny hurlers that are teaching. There is a double benefit if a lad is coaching in the school during the school year and then in the summer is able to fully concentrate on training/recovery and playing.

[Pat Mustard]

Regardless, the next manager of the senior team is probably not the most important thing right now. Without sounding sexist, there is probably a very high percentage of female teachers in our primary schools and even though the do their best to promote the game with the kids they probably don't have the right coaching or time to do all that is required.

I'd like to see a gaa coach going to the primary school to give coaching courses to a few eager parents from each school and let them take over and maybe a few weeks later get a refresher course.

Another problem which has been ongoing for years, look at our capital town tullamore. Probably a quarter of the population in the county living there if not more and they have done very little at underage in the last 20 years to suggest anything is being done. Edenderry, big population and can't field a fecking junior team. Clara, mediocre junior team. Ferbane, nothing without Belmont. So we only have the small towns of kilcormac, birr and banagher with surrounding areas to promote the game. Ballinamere for it's size seem to be making great progress so why can't others do the same?

Hit the nail on the head in order to be successful you need your big towns chipping in both hurling and football

[Lone Shark]

No it won't change a lads mind who is interested in medicine etc, but might help to sway a lad between primary and secondary teaching. Primary level attracts very few males. Teaching is probably the ideal job to have in terms of playing at inter county level due to the regular hours and long holidays.
Look at the number of Kilkenny hurlers that are teaching. There is a double benefit if a lad is coaching in the school during the school year and then in the summer is able to fully concentrate on training/recovery and playing.

Ask anyone not from Kilkenny about Kilkenny hurlers getting teaching jobs and they'll make it clear why that is - Kilkenny principals have shown huge bias towards local hurlers (to the point of being accused of doing so illegally), so in turn, Kilkenny hurlers know that on average, they'll get a job if they do a teaching course. In Dublin it's the same because there are a lot of teaching jobs up there, similarly in Cork (in the city at least), but that's not universally true across the rest of Ireland. I know several intercounty players that have struggled to get teaching jobs and if you genuinely want to get more players into this line of work, the key would be finding a way to get them hired, not finding a way to get them into college in the first place.

That won't be easy. Ridiculous though it sounds, most principals still like to give the best person the job - and while an intercounty player willing to give extra hours to training the local kids has one point in his favour and should of course get the job all other things being equal, if I was a parent in a particular area and a raw graduate got a job over another local candidate who had three or four years of full time experience, I'd be feeling a bit hard done by and would consider it a poor reflection on that principal's priorities.

[manfromdelmonte]

Or maybe applicants for jobs will know what is required for a successful application and get involved with their local club?
Carrot and stick etc

Every primary trainee from Kilkenny knows that being involved in hurling and camogie in their local club, in whatever way they can is a huge benefit to them

[Lone Shark]

Or maybe applicants for jobs will know what is required for a successful application and get involved with their local club?
Carrot and stick etc

Every primary trainee from Kilkenny knows that being involved in hurling and camogie in their local club, in whatever way they can is a huge benefit to them

I'm not trying to argue that it isn't a help - as I said above....

an intercounty player (or anyone!) willing to give extra hours to training the local kids has one point in his favour and should of course get the job all other things being equal.

The issue in Kilkenny is that there are hurlers with no teaching experience over and above the average graduate getting jobs ahead of Kilkenny natives who have years of practical teaching experience in Dublin under their belts already. This is a huge bone of contention down there (more so than most places) and it's not realistic to suggest that if Offaly footballers or hurlers can come out of St Pats with their qualification, they'll get the same treatment. It's a help, but it's not going to get you a permanent job easily by any stretch of the imagination.

As an aside, I think the point about the male female imbalance isn't quite as significant as it's made out to be. Of course it's anecdotal, but I know a few female teachers struggling to find permanent jobs and in two cases, they've done award one gaelic football coaching - the other has done foundation, but has also done high level rugby coaching. I'm not saying that's representative, but I don't think it's the 1980s either, where the one male staff member became the football/hurling coach by default.

[manfromdelmonte]

I suppose it depends on the school.

If a strong part of the culture in schools is sports, then as a principal most are going to give a job to someone who has a track record of doing some work in that in their own community. They don't have to have fancy coaching badges, just the willingness to give their time.

Do the county board foster any sort of a strong GAA culture in schools?

A lot of young teachers don't want to give their time to extra curricular activities in schools now.
A lot of clubs would better off spending money on putting a part time or voluntary coach into their school than paying money to their senior managers...

[Bord na Mona man]

Hit the nail on the head in order to be successful you need your big towns chipping in both hurling and football

Aye, but the problem with towns is that they are full of townies.
Trying to convert the sort of scaldy yokes you'd see in Tellamore into hurlers would require a magician!

[joe bloggs]

No it won't change a lads mind who is interested in medicine etc, but might help to sway a lad between primary and secondary teaching. Primary level attracts very few males. Teaching is probably the ideal job to have in terms of playing at inter county level due to the regular hours and long holidays.
Look at the number of Kilkenny hurlers that are teaching. There is a double benefit if a lad is coaching in the school during the school year and then in the summer is able to fully concentrate on training/recovery and playing.

Ask anyone not from Kilkenny about Kilkenny hurlers getting teaching jobs and they'll make it clear why that is - Kilkenny principals have shown huge bias towards local hurlers (to the point of being accused of doing so illegally), so in turn, Kilkenny hurlers know that on average, they'll get a job if they do a teaching course. In Dublin it's the same because there are a lot of teaching jobs up there, similarly in Cork (in the city at least), but that's not universally true across the rest of Ireland. I know several intercounty players that have struggled to get teaching jobs and if you genuinely want to get more players into this line of work, the key would be finding a way to get them hired, not finding a way to get them into college in the first place.

That won't be easy. Ridiculous though it sounds, most principals still like to give the best person the job - and while an intercounty player willing to give extra hours to training the local kids has one point in his favour and should of course get the job all other things being equal, if I was a parent in a particular area and a raw graduate got a job over another local candidate who had three or four years of full time experience, I'd be feeling a bit hard done by and would consider it a poor reflection on that principal's priorities.

I fully understand how the appointments system works, and no one would automatically get a job out of college in an area of their choosing. In fact getting a job anywhere would be difficult starting out, but after a few years experience it gets easier. Gradually over time we could build up a good number of current and former players working in schools across the county.
As you well acknowledge there is no short term solutions to our problems, and this is one possible solution that would take years to potentially pay off. I know so.e lads will go in to the profession regardless of a bursary, but having a few extra would help.
We need to look at a long hard road to get back anywhere near our previous peaks, and our primary schools will have to be part of our journey.

[bracknaghboy]

Edenderry, big population and can't field a fecking junior team.

I only heard myself last week that Edenderry had pulled out of the JHC. Big deal you might think......but this is actually significant. That team was the last outpost for lads from the east end of the county who wanted to hurl. Players from Daingean, Ballyfore, Rhode etc were on it and now that option for them is gone, not forgetting the players from the town itself. That's hurling finally dead that end of the county. Can True Red or Kingscounty shed any light on the situation there? They were in the county final in 2013 and now appear to gone. It all adds to the growing bleak hurling situation in the county.