NHL OFFaly v Laois 16 february 2014

[Toxicity234]

Lads where is lone shark and toxcity....at whelehans appointment before chistmas i explained to ye what would happen and ye all laughed and said dont be so negative today is just the start of a downward spiral in offaly hurling.oh wait we might get a performance against wexford or the corks of this world and we will all come on here and slay how the "BELIEVE" is back in the faithfull jersey.we have to realise that we are at noting nore do we have the hurlers or the management..5 years christy ring trophy sad but true.our big players is joe bergin..and the last time he hurled for 70 mins was against limerick around 4 years ago...were on a sinkinhg ship and whelehan is gonna be shown hes a duck out of water at county management

Babsandbond your remember that i fought the case like a bad dog to have an experience offaly manager put in charge. They was no point in saying that this is whelehan fault. He was ask to do the minor job and when the idiots of the County Board fucked up in appointing Duigum . after that the stupid fucker in the county board then when into appoint anyone BUT Danny Owens mode. Why because Danny Owens is a kilcormac killoughey man and he wanted the job.
But he wasn't from far enough south in the county to get the job. He was a Fianna Fáil man and he drank in the wrong pub. All black mark against him. Nothing to do with Hurling.

A few people on here has said that Laois were better than us yesterday. I agree but lets point out that if our management had made the right changes at half time we could have won that game. Laois were better than us yesterday but they were far from be good team themselves.

Let not kid ourselves here, most Christy Ring Cup team would have given us a run for our money yesterday. I can't believe that anyone here believe that Offaly hurling is that bad.
You know what if you line out Kilcormac killoughey club team they would have played better than Offaly yesterday. at least Kilcormac Killoughey would line out they best player in there best position. Laois were ok but no better than ok.

[Ahlethimoutwithit]

Hard to disagree with most of what you say Tox......the hardest hitting post so far. ANd before anyone comes on and says it, young Kelliher did well and got stuck in. What Loughnane should have said is that we lack the bottle when the gauntlet is thrown down.

I am disappointed for the genuine players and supporters in Offaly. They have gotten a raw deal from a county board mgt who have made a raft of rash appointments now in both hurliing and football. In turn these players to a degree have been short changed in terms of preparation.
I also feel sorry for some of those managers who might have done well if they had been given time to progress.

However, I hope to see some backlash the next day, we were woeful and yet were not that far off getting a result. But my fear is that we dont have the expertise to get the change in approach from the team.
There was an eerie silence among the crowd at the end of the game and almost an acceptance of what had taken place, have we moved beyond anger and disappoinment?
Time to fight back where it counts now and let County board know that this aint acceptable.

[allstar2010]

Absolutly love your passion Toxicity.... Could have done with that on the field yesterday, any chance you'll drop into the training sessions during the week and give a few home truths to both management and players!!

Listening to Whelahan speak on the radio he doesn't sound like a guy that can get a team up for a big game. Yesterday, his first league game, home game for fuck sake, win was imperative. Oh no... Don't send out your best team and get beat out the gate (2pts flattered us).

[sam88885a]

I agree with u tox but we have to learn quickly .
Respect every team i belive managment and players felt we win no matter what ,thats why g healion went on holliday and d currams didnt start and 4 defenders made there first start and 3 forwards were ruckies too .
we didnt slow laoise enough respect
the starting point of any team is to have a solid spine with leaders at centre back and centre forward we had a ruckie at full backat centre back and at full forward and j bergin at centre forward he is a talented hurler but he is lazy spineless joe wil never win a 50 50 ball he seem disintrested most of the time.
where is p cleary surely he would be muck better at centre back when we had so many young lads starting could s coughlan not play at wing back along side cleary and mooney why didnt currams kilmartain and mahon start?????
it was a bad first day but it time to put away egos and respect all team and in turn offaly can regain respect.
my team for wexford would be
j demsey
c mcdonald g healion j rigney
s gardner p cleary s coughlan
d kilmartain d mooney
c egan c mahon d currams
s quirke j bergin b carroll

we have to get point now or will be blooding lads in division 2

[substandard]

Wasn't at the game, and I'd have more of an interest in football myself, but there are parallels between this thread and the football equivalent.
It is better to light one candle than to sit around cursing the dark keeps going through my head when I read either thread. Was it last year there was a poll about who is to blame?
It's not just simply a matter of blame the county board or the management or the players or the 'structures' or any one or small number of stakeholders: it's the net result of an accumulation of issues over a prolonged period of time.
I'd be no great fan of some of those on the county board, and I wouldn't know most of them, but in fairness they have to operate within constraints- I don't know or can't speak for any posters here, but I for one could nor would ever be able to take on jobs like that.
Whelehan is relatively inexperienced as a manager; fair enough, but presumably he has picked up a hell of a lot from the last day- give him a chance to set it right. The definition of stupidity is making the same mistakes over and over and expecting a different outcome. If the selection is imbalanced again as it sounds from previous posts, and if appropriate changes aren't made, well then maybe something needs to be done. The management team is in place for better or worse, a tidal wave of negativity around them and the players isn't going to make preparing for the next game easier.
Look, every one has been predicting this for years, and every time at underage when Carlow, Laois or Westmeath got a result against Offaly, it was down to the 'Great work been done there'.
This 'Great work' has to start from primary schools, from under eights in clubs right up through secondary schools, and no excuses such as the numbers aren't there, or it was always a football/rugby/soccer area or whatever should be accepted.
I know Alan Mulhall has done super work behind the scenes with the football development squads- why isn't the hurling measuring up the same way? I'm not having a go at whoever is in the equivalent position in hurling, but from what I hear the teams aren't going so well.
How many of the current senior hurlers would have had any underage inter-county success?
Whelehan was a quick fix appointment after the perceived failure of Baker; until a successful conveyor belt can be implemented, then there will be many more days like Sunday, and I feel sorry for the players and the efforts and sacrifices they make, because they really are swimming against the tide even in Leinster, nevermind the All Ireland series...

[Bionic-eye]

Could not stomach to look at these comments until now. I have been sick since Sunday. The worst display of hurling I have ever seen in all my years attending GAA matches. I could not say any Offaly player stood out on the day. They were appaling to say the least. Not like a team that trained together at all. No leadership on the field. What were management thinking or were they thinking at all! Changes should have been made in the 1st half but management did nothing. When Brian Carroll had to run over to Brian Whelehan and point out the changes to make in the 2nd half what does that say about management. 'The tail wagging the dog or what!'

There is no point in management coming on the radio and blaming the players! Management were at fault here on the day and a blind man could see it!!!!!!

[Toxicity234]

Substandard i agree with a lot of what your saying.
Over the last few years i have gone to a huge amount of club game both underage and senior in Both Offaly and Dublin.
under-age is very important. But the great work done in other county is being done in Offaly. Offaly clubs are production hurlers and they are production brilliant hurlers.

Last years u21 were good enough to win Lenister if they have be manage better. Coughlan set up the team ok (better than most that have manage at that level) but refused to make the change required to stop Kilkenny from getting back into the game.
and last years u-21 panel was missing some of the best u21 players at that grade in the county, I'm not going to list the name but i can think of 6 of the top of my head. Tom Carroll Hurler the second half with a dislocated shoulder. That not player welfare that player abuse.

Our minor the last few years, The Bullshit of trying to play a running game. The minor in the county are brilliant striker of the ball. so instead of use the skill they build up at club level. someone thought i know we going to remove as much striking from our game as possible. That not playing to your strength that playing to your weakness. these lads will arrive into u21 with no idea of how the play to there strength. But worse when a good manger try to change the style of play to suit the players he has. they(the players) being think to themselves that this manager is old fashioned and we never win playing to our strength, Why because that what they being told of 3 or 4 years. That the real damage.

And our forward play at all levels. its frustration to watch club in Offaly play some wonderful forward play. Clareen, Coolderry, kilcormac Klloughey and Belmont. The two club that there forward play is somewhere between Poor and ok. are St Rynagh and Birr.
but watching Good forwards line play in the county. My Favorited at the moment are Kilcormac Killoughey and Belmont. The way they defend puck out are key. There Full forward line push out to a point where they can close both the full back line and half back line. But the moment the balls is hit the 3 inside forwards leg it back inside the 21. the 3 are not stand in front of goals they are all in there position. if a back win a ball and just hits under pressure it look like a good ball because they man at the end of it fight for it. they deal with the sweeper in the simple way possible. They know that the sweeper will always stand in front of the full back so they keep the ball away from the full back. A sweeper reduced there score rate but they trust that the extra man they have between the midfield and half back line will do more damage than the other teams sweeper.

At all county level the full forward line come out close down the half forward line too much. Short puck out become a problem but its only a problem in our heads. so they close the full back line down. our half forward line is push back so the goalkeeper give the ball to the centre back who drops it in on top of our full back line. The full forward lines at club level know that some short puck out are going to catch them out. but as long as it as the ball in dropping on our half back they are in control. If the ball is dropping on our full back line we are in trouble

This has being lost when clubs players get to county level. They are drill so hard that they forget that they can't win every battle and as long as the ball in hitting our half back we have a great chance to win it back and sent it back into the danger zone. This is the other problem with Offaly forwards at the moment. The amount of time the full forward line spend out of position. its bullshit. We all being on here given out about not picking out a forwards when we have the ball. But if you have no forwards in the forwards line it would be like look for Waldo in a dictionary.

[Plain of the Herbs]

You make some good points but, I'd be astonished if there are six U21 players who were not on the county panel. Who do you have in mind?

Last years u21 were good enough to win Lenister if they have be manage better. Coughlan set up the team ok (better than most that have manage at that level) but refused to make the change required to stop Kilkenny from getting back into the game.
and last years u-21 panel was missing some of the best u21 players at that grade in the county, I'm not going to list the name but i can think of 6 of the top of my head. Tom Carroll Hurler the second half with a dislocated shoulder. That not player welfare that player abuse.

[Toxicity234]

Enda Gorgan. Brendan Murphy, Conor Doughan. Kevin Connelly. Dónal Morkan and Ryan for Clareen ( can't remember his first name). That six were in my head.
but now that I have wrote it down. Where Murphy and Connelly under 21 last year.

Read back over my post here I being to hard on Bergin and Parlon. In fairness to the two lads they were both played out of position. I know the management and players are doing there best but there is no place time for learning on the job in league hurling. every game in important and we are in big trouble at the moment. The management need to get it together. put the results behind us and get back on track.
Our League start Sunday.
I'll be in New Ross on Sunday to supporter the team. I just hope that I see a smarted game plan and players play in the correct position.

[GreatDayForTheParish]

Stupidity is often defined as doing the same thing again and again yet expecting different results.

The Offaly team that lost last year's championship game to Waterford was remarkably similar to that which bowed out (with considerably more pride) against the same opposition on that day in Thurles in 2008. In that intervening period, that Offaly team and those players made little or no progress. To go out yet again this year, with little or no changes, would indeed have been stupid. I thus don't have much of an issue with the management team for experimenting considerably with the line up. It is needed and sometimes these things don't work out - deal with it. How they adapt and learn from the mistakes of Sunday is what will define them. I would actually take more umbrage with the starting of players who at the best of times offered little to inter county hurling and now certainly don't. Sunday's midfield combination being but one example.

Hindsight being foresight to a gobshite. People would also be wise not to elevate players simply by their absence. Various calls for Ger Healion and Conor Mahon to be parachuted into the team, saviors of our ills apparently. To revise short memories, those two players have had numerous years and numerous opportunities on the Offaly team. In this time their impact and ability has been limited. Lets get real.

James Dempsey, David Kenny, Rory Hanniffy, Derek Morkan, Joe Bergin, a fit and lean Shane Dooley and Stephen Quirke would be the definite names on my teamsheet. Everything and everybody else is fair game for now.

For remember, to do nothing, to persist with the status quo would have been stupid.

[Observant 7]

Great day For the Parish! Conor Mahon is 2013 Senior Hurler of the Year, i'm sure there is a reason for this title.

He has contributed as good as many if not more over his year at County level therefore in my opinion your remarks are unfair

[Killeighman]

Jaysus i think Conor Mahon is the height of awkwardness on a field. You have all these lads that can produce the goods at club level but they can never bring it up to intercounty standard E.G Conor Mahon

[Plain of the Herbs]

Granted CM is no Rory Hanniffy when it comes to stroke play, but the lad has made savage improvement to his striking during the last year or so. His swing is much more orthodox now, and is evidence he has put a serious amount of work into his swing.

Jaysus i think Conor Mahon is the height of awkwardness on a field. You have all these lads that can produce the goods at club level but they can never bring it up to intercounty standard E.G Conor Mahon

[Toxicity234]

Ger Healion and Conor Mahon.

It hard to say that these two lads impact on the county team has being limited.
Ger Healion Best position is full back but he has never player in that position for Offaly. Healion has being messed around with. how many time have to heard he not fast enough for inter-county hurling. Its rubbish. listen to some people you think David Kenny was Usain Bolt. Healion was excellent at centre back of the 3 games he played there last year.

Mahon has turned into an outstanding Centre Forward. if you don't believe me ask Brick Walsh and Padraig Maher. He is awkward, He awkward like John Power was awkward.

James Dempsey, David Kenny, Rory Hanniffy, Derek Morkan, Joe Bergin, a fit and lean Shane Dooley and Stephen Quirke would be the definite names on my teamsheet

If these name are the first on your team sheet then Daimen Kilmartin must be included. He has out Hurler everyone you have named over the last two years.
I can't remember the last time Hanniffy or Dooley put in a complete 60 mins of hurling . Kilmartin i can think of 5 or 6 preformance over the last two years.

[King Kev]

Ger Healion was badly exposed in the county final against birr taken for 4 points mullins also hit a few wides due to his inexperience. Intercounty is totally different Ger would be destroyed full back inter county. David Kenny is a far better reader of the game a better all round hurler lets be realistic. Awkward like John Power i dont think so. John Power was one of the best centre forwards of his generation to compare mahon to him is a bit of a laugh. Kilmartin got 25 mins the other day against laois and never hit a ball. Compare his impact to Sean Clearys who in 12 mins made a serious difference with his pace troubling the laois defence. Stephen Quirke made a big difference when introduced at half time also. My point is these lads might do well with the club but intercounty is a different kettle of fish.