Clubs in the doldrums

[Hesnoaveragejoe]

Tonight I was looking through the past senior football winners and noticed that all of these past winners in the last 80 years have a club playing either senior or intermediate football (some play both) with the exception of Daingean.
A couple of things I want to put out there
1. Is this a common occurance.
2. Is there any other clubs in either code who have experienced such a decline. If so who

[Fargo Boyle]

Oh i see another thinnly veiled "lets have another bash at Daingean" thread.

Let me throw my two cents into the mix. St Vincents underage structure is killing Daingean football. There I said it, its off my chest now.

*cue vigourous attacks on my opinion

[Daleamar]

How is St. Vincents underage killing Daingean football? This I really want to know the answer for?

Daingean football was killed because it was not thought properly in the primary school for many a year.

[Fargo Boyle]

The bastardised system is doing no one any good. No other county has such an underage system and when I discuss the structure with other county men they can't understand it.

Daingean school has approx 30 boys for each underage category. Daingean should concentrate on keeping these lads in the game by offering them game time, not sitting on the bench watching other lads from the 3 clubs play. This results in them losing interest and opting out of the game.

If this means dropping to B standard so be it. I look at the Gracefield example as a good model.

Daingean need 15 minors coming through every year not 1 or 2. If the parish rule is not going to brought in then I think Daingean should form their won underage teams asap.

[Daleamar]

The bastardised system is doing no one any good. No other county has such an underage system and when I discuss the structure with other county men they can't understand it.

Daingean school has approx 30 boys for each underage category. Daingean should concentrate on keeping these lads in the game by offering them game time, not sitting on the bench watching other lads from the 3 clubs play. This results in them losing interest and opting out of the game.

If this means dropping to B standard so be it. I look at the Gracefield example as a good model.

Daingean need 15 minors coming through every year not 1 or 2. If the parish rule is not going to brought in then I think Daingean should form their won underage teams asap.

Im not sure what you mean by bastardised structure? Na Fianna have the same underage system and they are starting to get to A finals.

The problem is that it the good early work done, in getting it set up and getting everyone to buy into it and get involved, has fizzled out. There has been no progression in regards to training and getting good trainers in since it was started.

If by bastardised system you mean that a selector from each club and thus a certain number of players are on from each club as a result. Yes this is a woeful system. I dont believe there are too many not getting on the teams because there 'quota' is filled. However, when it comes to making substitues/tactical changes it is detrimental. By the time the subs/changes are made its often too late to curb the problems. Too many selectors involved with their own agendas. i.e. trying to get their clubman/son on regardless if its the best decision or not. Its a huge reason that St. Vincents get to so many underage finals and always ending the runner up.

Im not sure how this is affecting Daingean more than others exactly though? Is it they have so many players that arent good enough to get on the team? I do agree that there should be A and B teams there if the numbers allow. Young lads should be getting the opportunity to play competitive matches. Its the only way to improve.

[Fargo Boyle]

What i mean is that this does not happen in too many other counties only Offaly. Many rural clubs in other counties can barely scrap together a team yet the last thing they would do is join up with another club. Most clubs throughout the country have their underage structure as part of the club but this is not the case with st Vincent's as it is a separate club to the adult clubs and therefore does not sit anywhere in particular.

If daingean have enough young lads to sustain teams at underage (which i hear they have) then they should go for it. By exposing weaker young lads to championship football at an early age they could improve. They definitely won't improve on the bench and subsequently sitting at home because they can't get a game and get frustrated and lose interest. Plus the fact that a team would stick together right up through the ranks would help develop them as a group.

[Daleamar]

What i mean is that this does not happen in too many other counties only Offaly. Many rural clubs in other counties can barely scrap together a team yet the last thing they would do is join up with another club. Most clubs throughout the country have their underage structure as part of the club but this is not the case with st Vincent's as it is a separate club to the adult clubs and therefore does not sit anywhere in particular.

If daingean have enough young lads to sustain teams at underage (which i hear they have) then they should go for it. By exposing weaker young lads to championship football at an early age they could improve. They definitely won't improve on the bench and subsequently sitting at home because they can't get a game and get frustrated and lose interest. Plus the fact that a team would stick together right up through the ranks would help develop them as a group.

I dont see the problem but you obvioulsy do. Look at all the under 21 teams that join up. Look at Kerry, they immagimate parishes for a senior championship down there.

Its alright having enough players for u12 and u14 teams, what do you do then at u16 and minor when lads prefer to do other things in their lives, and leave football behind, because the fact is, barring a small minority, anybody thats good/likes playing football, stays playing football.

[joe bloggs]

How is St. Vincents underage killing Daingean football? This I really want to know the answer for?

Daingean football was killed because it was not thought properly in the primary school for many a year.

I'd say wherever you went to school English was not taught very well

[Daleamar]

How is St. Vincents underage killing Daingean football? This I really want to know the answer for?

Daingean football was killed because it was not thought properly in the primary school for many a year.

I'd say wherever you went to school English was not taught very well

I'd say, wherever you went to school, English was not taught very well.

4got ur pnctuatn der GENIOUS.

And in fact it wasnt being thought at all for a while in Daingeans primary schools, so if your not going to come on here with a decent point, why bother?

[Ahlethimoutwithit]

Yep Fargo, best of luck with that. Would there be a D championship with 7 aside games for Daingean.

By the way have you heard of
Na Fianna, Broughans, DER gaels, Fer/Bel (plus Shannonbridge), Ballycumber/Tubber,

Shamrocks/KK/St Rynaghs/ Graefield are there own club's and parish. Vincents is the way, and Daingean need to see how they can improve their participation in this entity, rather than take notice of pub talk from the likes of you!!

Delamar make valid points re the quality of coaches/ but you need the past players to step up to the mark in this regard for this to improve.

[Fargo Boyle]

Yep Fargo, best of luck with that. Would there be a D championship with 7 aside games for Daingean.

By the way have you heard of
Na Fianna, Broughans, DER gaels, Fer/Bel (plus Shannonbridge), Ballycumber/Tubber,

Shamrocks/KK/St Rynaghs/ Graefield are there own club's and parish. Vincents is the way, and Daingean need to see how they can improve their participation in this entity, rather than take notice of pub talk from the likes of you!!

Delamar make valid points re the quality of coaches/ but you need the past players to step up to the mark in this regard for this to improve.

May I be the first to congratulate you on the quality of your post. In all of your 253 posts of the highest quality and unnerving analysis this must rank as your finest hour.

I would enjoy meeting for some "pub talk" and a cordial sherry some time in one of the many fine watering holes in the hovel that you hail from however logistics are against us due to my current living arrangements. But fear not, because of your great post you have quenched anymore talk of Daingean forming their own underage structure.

As the great Frank Zappa once siad: "There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the universe, and it has a longer shelf life"

[Daleamar]

It hard to turn into a slagging match. Tut tut.

[Fargo Boyle]

It hard to turn into a slagging match. Tut tut.

Not so Daleamar, in fact many our of your posts made perfect sense and would be worth brining to Vincents.

I still think that Daingean require an underage structure that is fit for purpose with a core mission of getting as many young Daingean players onto the playing pitch and imho that can only be through a Daingean underage setup. It can be done if the will is there. I would first like to have a complete review and analysis of the numbers that have passed through the Vincents setup and are these players still involved and if not, why not. I think that would be a reasonable start.

[backofthenet]

Just add my three cents here...what is the aim of joining clubs together? If the aim is to give players an opportunity to play that they wouldnt otherwise have then it is a good idea...what appears to be happening at the moment is that clubs who for whatever reason are not currently competing at the top level are joining up in order to compete at the top level bringing participation down in order to try achieve some short term success.

If Daingean has 30 players at every grade, it makes absolutely no sense to not field their own team. If go games is a success because it gives each player an equal opportunity to compete and improve, surely daingean having 15 rather than 5 players on the pitch at any one time makes more sense??

Im not a football man so I can only take the example of Brosna Gaels, clearly a number of clubs joined together, a number of whom have the numbers to sustain their own club team, however they have sacrificed this in order to gain success. It is patently unfair on the other clubs in the county and could lead to other clubs joining up to try and compete back which will end up in less clubs, less participation.

[Daleamar]

Just add my three cents here...what is the aim of joining clubs together? If the aim is to give players an opportunity to play that they wouldnt otherwise have then it is a good idea...what appears to be happening at the moment is that clubs who for whatever reason are not currently competing at the top level are joining up in order to compete at the top level bringing participation down in order to try achieve some short term success.

If Daingean has 30 players at every grade, it makes absolutely no sense to not field their own team. If go games is a success because it gives each player an equal opportunity to compete and improve, surely daingean having 15 rather than 5 players on the pitch at any one time makes more sense??

Im not a football man so I can only take the example of Brosna Gaels, clearly a number of clubs joined together, a number of whom have the numbers to sustain their own club team, however they have sacrificed this in order to gain success. It is patently unfair on the other clubs in the county and could lead to other clubs joining up to try and compete back which will end up in less clubs, less participation.

This was definitely not why St. Vincents was set up. It was set up because there was a need for it. No club could put out a team of their own.

And I dont know where your plucking figures of 30 players at each grade for Daingean but if there is (which I would be greatly surprised) then thats something Daingean need to address. Vincents have fought there way from the start, started in the B grade and moved up. Started with no players on Offaly underage panels and progressed slowly to the position they are in now with a few at each grade. I cannot see how that can be frowned upon either inside or outside the parish of Daingean.

On Brosna Gaels, I dont know much about it but if you say there is enough players for teams to go on their own? For how long? The reason tehres a turn out is because players want to be involved in successful team and parents want their kids involved in that. I could almost guarantee that you split up the teams, they are not as successful, players lose interest, parents lose interest and your back at square one. When an immalgamation club is successful everybody thinks they would be as good on their own. That is simply untrue.

On a further note, 3 out of the 4 clubs in Daingean parish have won their respective adult championships since St. Vincents was established. This should prove further that St. Vincents has been and is a success.