Offaly Minor Hurling 2010

[Offalys Future]

Have attempted to get back on the forum but for different reasons never got around to it.
Before i start i want you to read this with an open mind, lets forget about all previous posts, look at the truth
and the facts and then come up with your own opinion not what others say. Because am sure there will be a few
that will try and ruin this post. We are now in 2009 its time to move forward for the better of Offaly GAA.

Minor Hurling
What a diaster of a two years we are after having. A complete waste and an awful shame. Thats in the past now
and its time to move on. The appointment of Joe Cleary and Damien Fox didnt really surprise me to be honest.
Fox would be friendly with the "click" that exists in Offaly GAA at the moment and Joe Cleary only got the job
because the u-15 management left during the year and he filled in for them.
What Offaly Minor hurlers need is a really good professional setup now. Any man that is playing hurling at 48 has something special
inside him and if he can get across his interest and love of the game then he will be a priceless asset to have.
But i think they need to get a good hurling coach in there and also a physical trainer that has dealt with intercounty teams before.
This minor team has a real chance of success next year but unless the right men are brought on board it just wont happen.

Joe Cleary and Damien Fox should organise and create a great spirit inside the camp and get the best people they can possibly
get to coach and train these lads. Money should not be spared in the pursuit of excellence and success.
But my fear is that this wont happen. Cleary is known to be very disorganised, Fox wont be willing to take a lesser role.
They will try to do it themselves but will fail. They will come close and the general consensus will be that they done a great job.
They have held trial games already in the middle of November which is crazy. Fitness tests, nutrition analysis, weight programmes etc
is what should be going on over the net 3 months not meaningless trial games in the muck and shite.

In order for Offaly hurling to get back to a competitive level, a different approach needs to be taken and done asap.
you cant have a minor championship final taken place in the middle of November.
You cant have people over teams that dont know what they are doing.
You need unity within the county.
A forum should be called with the minor management and all clubs. Set their stall out for early in the year and lets get everyone working
in the one direction. This is what needs to be done for Ofaly minor teams to go forward and to be successful.

I just pray for the sake of these very talented minors that both these men and the county board know what they are doing.
My opinion is that they dont and this time next year we will be talking about what could have been.

[Plain of the Herbs]

I would like to echo the sentiments of OF regarding issues such as physical preparation, conditioning and nutrition.

For too long Offaly has treated these areas as an optional extra. We laugh at other counties who address these issues from a young age while we concentrate on hitting a wet hurling ball ten yards on the ground. Then we wring our hands when we can’t compete with say, Clare, Limerick or Wexford or the likes on the hurling field.

The Noughties is over and it’s been a miserable decade on the hurling fields, and hurling has moved to a whole new plane during that decade, but Offaly still needs to move into the Noughties if it is to regain the competitiveness that it lost over the course of that decade.

[Offalys Future]

While it would hurt it wouldnt bother me if Offaly never won anything again once our young
players went out on the field prepared to the best they possibly could and given every opportunity
to improve and be successful. Because i know if this happened success would follow.
This hasnt happened for years and why not change that now.
It would cost as little as 500 euro to get 30 players properly tested and training programmes given
to each of them for 4 months. Jesus i'd pay that myself.

I have seen first hand and even last winter some senior players in public gyms shitein around on weights
that they dont even know themselves what they are doing. Its actually embarrassing.

[leinsterman]

The man for the job over offaly minors should have been pa joe whelehan and should have got it years ago.
we have won nothing in minor for years every tom dick and harry has been over the minors for the last ten years.
i was at the match last year against westmeath and we hit a new low that day, when westmeath start beating you in
any grade of hurling you are in trouble, young players in offaly can't catch the ball anymore our skill and touch have gone
who is coaching theses young lads. pa joe was a good man for ground hurling and done alot of ball work and skills,
i think the only thing they do now with young lads is run them around the field like greyhounds. people say theres
good young hurlers out there where are they, this years county final tullamores kevin martin was the best on the field
and if you go back to 08 and 07 county finals brian whelehan was man of the match. we will fall futher behind if we don't
get someone in that can get the best out of our young players. maybe an outsider for a change johnny pilkington and johnny dooley
were over them the last few years and not one player has come up from minor level that you could say he be a good one.
you need someone over young lads that can show them and learn them the skills of hurling and can train a team to hurl and win
that someone should have been pa joe.

[Offalys Future]

Leinsterman just or your knowledge it is exactly because of people like Pad Joe Whelehan
that Offaly hurling is the way it is now.
He is a bully and has ran a dictatorship in Birr for a long time now.
I can name yout at least 20 hurlers many of them young players that have walked away
from that club because of him and brian.
He has treated players and managers from other clubs with little or no respect down through the years
and in his eyes Birr's success will always be more important than Offaly.
It was his attitude that created a devoid between Birr and Offaly and i have no doubt it was him that ruined
players like Dylan Hayden and Stephen Brown of been really top class players.

I hate Pad Joe Whelehan and everything he stands for when it comes to GAA. Just ask anyone from Birr
and you will understand exactly what i am talking about.

Ground hurling is finished jesus. We need top coaches who know how to coach and condition players to a
required level. Not money men that havent a clue.

[leinsterman]

Leinsterman just or your knowledge it is exactly because of people like Pad Joe Whelehan
that Offaly hurling is the way it is now.
He is a bully and has ran a dictatorship in Birr for a long time now.
I can name yout at least 20 hurlers many of them young players that have walked away
from that club because of him and brian.
He has treated players and managers from other clubs with little or no respect down through the years
and in his eyes Birr's success will always be more important than Offaly.
It was his attitude that created a devoid between Birr and Offaly and i have no doubt it was him that ruined
players like Dylan Hayden and Stephen Brown of been really top class players.

I hate Pad Joe Whelehan and everything he stands for when it comes to GAA. Just ask anyone from Birr
and you will understand exactly what i am talking about.

Ground hurling is finished jesus. We need top coaches who know how to coach and condition players to a
required level. Not money men that havent a clue.

offalys future look what pa joe won with birr many county titles leinster titles and allirelands. 3 minor allirelands
under 21 leinster and senior titles plus trained toomerva in tipp and limerick seniors and you say he knows nothing.
what 20 players walk away i am following birr a long time now the only players that walk away were the ones that
didn't cut it alot of them players were fond of the highstool if you knew the truth. dylan hayden is on the offaly panel

stephen browne would be if he bother his arse to put the efford into it.no one in birr was saying anything about pa joe
when they put club titles back to back was their. then you blame sid as well i tell you you want to cop on to yourself
he put birr on the map with what he won in hurling. just because you have a problem with the whelehans you don't
have to run them down or what they done for offaly and birr or maybe your one of the 20 players that weren't good enough
to get on them great birr teams. you should look at what pa joe has won before you start talking rubbish about him.
he won 10 county titles with st. rynaghs as well but sure as you said offalys future he knows nothing about hurling
i think if you look back at what you wrote about pa joe not having a clue makes you look the muppet

[blues brother]

a pair of muppets.both of yee talking complete rubbish

[Plain of the Herbs]

Should have got it years ago? He trained the minors in ’94 and ’95, remember? Remember ’95?

Anyway, hurling is unrecognisable now compared to ten years ago, never mind twenty. We badly need some progressive thinking – not endless ground hurling drills and poking low ball to opposing defenders who burst out in front of hapless forwards and return it with interest down the field.

You’re taking a bit of licence there stating that Kevin Martin was the best man on the field. You’re also being unfair to the other Tullamore hurlers. There were plenty of Tullamore men who performed better than him that day – everyone knows who they are, too and I don’t need to name them.

In fact, the Tullamore style of hurling is well worth looking at. Defenders who attack the ball - physically strong and use it – their support of the ball carrier is deliberate – their handling of the ball is well versed and they rarely waste possession.

As for “not one player has come up from minor level that you could say he be a good one” I would say that the hurlers Johnny P had at minor level are 18 and 19, and are hardly lost causes. What years did Johnny D have the minors? The under 21 hurlers went to Nowlan Park this year with very little preparation and should have won – the under 21’s won in Nowlan Park two years ago. That’s not to say there isn’t a problem – there patently is, and underperforming at minor level is a handicap, but PJW is not the answer.

U going to give PJW a vote at the Birr AGM on Sunday Leinsterman?

The man for the job over offaly minors should have been pa joe whelehan and should have got it years ago.
we have won nothing in minor for years every tom dick and harry has been over the minors for the last ten years.
i was at the match last year against westmeath and we hit a new low that day, when westmeath start beating you in
any grade of hurling you are in trouble, young players in offaly can't catch the ball anymore our skill and touch have gone
who is coaching theses young lads. pa joe was a good man for ground hurling and done alot of ball work and skills,
i think the only thing they do now with young lads is run them around the field like greyhounds. people say theres
good young hurlers out there where are they, this years county final tullamores kevin martin was the best on the field
and if you go back to 08 and 07 county finals brian whelehan was man of the match. we will fall futher behind if we don't
get someone in that can get the best out of our young players. maybe an outsider for a change johnny pilkington and johnny dooley
were over them the last few years and not one player has come up from minor level that you could say he be a good one.
you need someone over young lads that can show them and learn them the skills of hurling and can train a team to hurl and win
that someone should have been pa joe.

[leinsterman]

jasus theres theres alot of pa joe hater's on this site why is this because birr dominant of offaly hurling
for the last few years, and plain of the herbs pa jo doesn't have to prove himself or need my vote to prove himself
to birr hurling. plus you were quick to point out 94 and 95 minor teams, and never said anything about the 86, 87 , 89,
teams. bye the way how many on the 94, or 95 minor teams won allireland medal after. well at least he was geting teams
to finals then ,we struggle against kildare in 08 in nass and westmeath last year and you were point out that the teams in 95
was bet in leinster finals bye good kilkenny teams. you can hold your head up if kk beat yea but westmeath???
but sure you get people that don't like brian cody either because he has trained teams to be successful . i would call it jealously.

[Plain of the Herbs]

Lest there be any confusion, I am not a 'hater' of PJW. I respect what he has achieved both as a hurler and a coach. Thing is - he is not the man for Offaly hurling at this time given the way hurling has moved on nationally.

Also, Leinsterman is probably being unfair on the Birr players if he feels PJW was the ultimate key to their success. The hurlers PJW had at his disposal were a fine bunch of hurlers in their own right. Leinsterman shouldn't forget that Birr won two county titles in recent years with John Goode in charge.

And finally on PJW, he got the task of coaching the county senior team in 1989 and lost that post a year later due to his own stubbornness.

Anyway, back to the original topic . . . the minors?

[Offalys Future]

Just want to finish off the Birr topic with this:

Why do people keep going back to the 80's? jesus chriest.
Anyone with a brain knows that Birr had an extraordinary group of players over a 10 year period and
it was because of these players and these players alone that they had the success they had.
Especially they had Brian Whelehan who in his prime was the greatest defender i have ever seen play.
Oh i never said he hasnt a clue about hurling. I have said that he has destroyed the Birr club and
now in 2009/2010 he isnt capable of training/managing or coaching a club or intercounty team of any description.
But Birr under padjoe never gave a shit about offaly hurling, his mentality came across to the players
and there was a big devoid in offaly senior panels for years.
Oh BTW Toomevara got rid of him as did Limerick. Also he went for an interview for Galway and Dublin
jobs and he was laughed out of the room.
Birr never took part in the county league for years either. Didnt give a shit about offaly hurling.
Look at the state of the birr club now. Underage at an all time low. Seniors struggling and will struggle until
the get rid of padjoe. Pitch out of action for 2 years, and now when money needs to be invested in the schools and
coaching, here now they are trying to waste money on a terrace when Tullamore is where all big games should be played.
Jesus they dont even have a proper size dressing room there.
And Leinsterman there is much more to a club than success. No one man or one family should be allowed dictate a club, a club is
the communtiy's and no player should ever have to walk away from his club. The club is bigger than 1 man.

But where talking about a minor manager job with 16.17.18 year olds.
Ye keep going back to ground hurling and success in the 80's.
Offaly needs good coaches, they need players conditioned to compete.
Leinsterman were you in Nowlan Park last year for the minor game vs Kilkenny.
Probably not but for your info Offaly had as good a minor team as Kilkenny but were'nt coached weren't
trained properly and really missed an opportunity. These players deserve better.
So much time is put into training teams etc now that you have to have the best people for the job or players
will walk away.
Wake up for chriest sakes.

[leinsterman]

offalys future
your wrong again on stuff you wrote, birr never gave a shit about offaly hurling, thats funny how come in 1994 we had 7 players on the panel
and in 1998 we had 7 as well in 98 sid and joe Errity got 2-9 between them not bad for a club that doesn't give a shite about the county,
plus the club has won 4 club allirelands for the county the only ones to bring the tommy moore cup to offaly.
another point you said sid isnt able to coach teams thats funny he has just took over at camross and trained team in galway.
you said pa joe was ran out of toomervara did he not win a county title with them in don't know the year think 94 or was it later
don't think you were at the minor match last year either they played wexford in wexford park after beating kildare in nass
and yes i was at it don't know what match you were looking at in nowlan park in 08 you weren't at it so.
you said club is at a all time low you must have not seen birr in the 80s so. what club are you from bye the way.
we won't be to far away from winning the county title in 2010 either wait and see.
then you said about the pitch all the matches should be in tullamore you must be from the football end so
because anyone i talk to from birr, coolderry, seir kierans, rynaghs, kinnitty, would rather have the hurling in birr.
so check up your facts about birr and offaly hurling before you start posted rubbish on the site. cheers.

[lovelyhurling]

leinsterman. will you format your posts? Haven't a clue what your saying.

[Bord na Mona man]

I think people are getting sidetracked here.
The problem or solution doesn't rest with any one individual at the coal face, so I don't see the point in personalising it.

I doesn't take a genius to work out that Offaly's major problem in recent years is a lack of skills coaching. We have plenty of management, but we don't have enough coaching. Holding trials, picking teams, settling on tactics etc are all management stuff.
At that stage it is too late to actually make a difference.

Do we really expect our minor management, when they've decided who their panel is, to then start trying to teach each player the skills of the game they are deficient in?
Maybe the fact that trials have to be held in the first place, shows that players don't receive enough monitoring and mentoring when they are learning the game?

Ground hurling is a symptom of this problem.
If you have to manage a group of players with poor catching ability, poor lifting ability, poor ball control, poor vision, poor soloing ability, poor decision making and lacking physical conditioning then your best solution is the send out to swat at every ball comes within 6 feet of them and hope for the best.
Get them fired up like loonies on the day and for the first 20 minutes swing at everything that comes their way. Chase every possession they turn over like dogs. Tire in the second half and get dismantled.

Ground hurling should be a skill rather than a gameplan at this stage.

[uibhfhaili]

Have the draws been made yet? Why the optimism for this bunch? We are behind Westmeath and Carlow at this grade at this stage aft er the JP years. I saw KK playing in the U17 tournament in Mallow this yr and their are an awesome outfit. Big ,strong, muscular and loads of hurling. The scary thing is they were without their best players who were involved with their minor side. Are Dublin and Wexford poor this yr?