Senior A Hurling 2019

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.

Senior A County Champions 2019

St. Rynaghs
9
35%
Coolderry
4
15%
KK
3
12%
Kinnitty
0
No votes
Belmont
4
15%
Ballinamere/Durrow
1
4%
Shinrone
0
No votes
Birr
5
19%
 
Total votes: 26

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Lone Shark
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Lone Shark » Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:08 pm

Logic would dictate that the two quarter finals would be in Birr absolutely, and I don't know if it is the case or not that Shinrone were given the choice of playing at their opponents' home field or going to Tullamore, but if they were, I'd suggest they took the right option. Birr have a lot more hurlers that are in the latter stages of their career and even based on style of play, the extra bit of space should suit Shinrone. They also have a very poor record in OCP generally, and will need to get on top of that if they're going to win a county title, which you'd have to presume is the primary aim of all six clubs from here on.
Fairplayalways wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:41 am
I seen them hurl there this year and from I see of Shinrone they are hurling well enough to hurl anywhere, having said that, they would be guaranteed a good home support (which they will have anyway I suppose) and alot of neutral support if it was in Birr.
I'm curious as to your logic in this one. I've no dog in the hunt and as people know, I don't live in the county now, so I might be missing something. Why would neutrals be more inclined to support Shinrone than Birr?

Leaving out for a moment that I don't think the "passionate" support of neutrals is likely to be a factor in any game.
Fairplayalways wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:46 am
.Shinrone would love to play Birr in Birr Ide imagine..dragging two clubs from same general area to over to Tullamore...not rehashing the OCP debate again but all QF teams are from South Offaly.
No, sorry, I'm not having this. I'm not a believer in the idea of separate communities in our county at the best of times, but if you are going to draw a line, then Belmont are West Offaly. Not north, not south, west. For those who don't accept this, google West Offaly. It'll bring up three results, and right, smack bang in the middle of the triangle is Belmont. :D
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

Fairplayalways
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Fairplayalways » Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:34 pm

Google Offaly??? isnt laois in Irelands ancient East from what I hear according to advertisements on radio:))...every year those supposedly educated commentators on Rte Radio one welcome us on the 2nd Sunday in May to a midlands derby between Carlow and Longford in the Leinster Senior football championship:(...just today I was discussing the Tipperary championship structure and a chap never heard of the north, mid or West or South finals....no mention of the East Final by the way as there isnt one..are we going to be 100% accurate in every county even if we havent the clubs to make up the numbers, Shannon Bridge, Doon etc. will have to go find a team then to play in an Offaly West championship!...defend OCP anyway no matter what..

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Lone Shark
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Lone Shark » Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:01 pm

I don't know where to start with all that to be honest. In a nutshell...

(1) This isn't "defending OCP" - as I said, the ideal would be a double header in Birr. But sporting fairness would decree that since SBP is a club ground, it's not reasonable to expect another club to play the home club in a knockout game there against their will. And given a choice, of course Shinrone should choose the option that suits them best.

(2) Ye mightn't like it, but there is a West Offaly identity, and it means something to those of us who grew up there or are part of it. That's not to say we're any less or more "Offaly" than anyone else, but it is a thing, and Belmont would very much be part of it.

(3) I'll ask again - why would neutrals support Shinrone over Birr, exactly?
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

Fairplayalways
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Fairplayalways » Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:58 pm

Birr have 4 All Ireland Club titles, a few appearances also in AI club finals, a a few more Leinster Club Championships won, again appeared in a numerous Leinster Club finals, have won 22 titles or so, appeared in numerous, peppered with stars over the years..Shinrone have never won a senior title, appeared only in 1 or 2 max if I remember right...most genuine neutrals will support such teams against someone of Birrs pedigree..nothing personal against Birr, have the height of respect for them and know some of their players/former players/managers and you wouldnt meet sounder...neutrals support isnt going to mean anything to Shinrone on the day agaisnt Birr, but you can bet alot from Banagher/Lusmagh/Clareen etc. would be in SBC, and would based on the stats above, support Shinrone against Birr, nothing wrong with thant scenario as a neutral...Belmont in West Offaly is a fact, the reason there arent other senior clubs in the places named ealier, like the rest of the of the county, due to lack of population we have the clubs we have, Ime sure all small clubs would love to have the numbers to field their own senior...If we had the platter of clubs in Tipp, and if the county was as big, Ime saying we could have a North & South championship etc..we havent, so that is not an argument..

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Plain of the Herbs » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:17 pm

Sure now?
Fairplayalways wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:46 am
but all QF teams are from South Offaly..
Fairplayalways wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:58 pm
Belmont in West Offaly is a fact
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Plain of the Herbs » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:19 pm

Leave it to the hurlers! Glad you enjoyed it (and I think I remember you passing a similar comment at the time).
bracknaghboy wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:41 pm
The 2016 Junior B final between Lusmagh and Rhode was one of the most enjoyable games I can remember in the last 20 years. Lusmagh just said fuck it and had a go at them right from the start......there was no sweepers or handpassing that evening and it was a joy to behold!!
Pat Donegan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by greenairfield » Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:23 pm

I think both teams will be eager to play in Tullamore as the county final will be there.


Just to pick up on your comment Lone Shark on alot of the Birr players coming to the latter stage of there careers.

Not taking into account Breeder Mullins as hes a goalie who I might add has been at a different level this year in goals.
(Without doubt the best goalie in the county I think alot of people would say say this even from outside Birr)

The team is not that old...the half back line are all 33 but have dominated most games and on paper are the best half back line in the county.

Then you have Lonergan and Hayden who are also in there 30s ..that leaves nine players in there 20s with the full back line been particularly young.

I wouldn't say it's an old team as you suggested. :mrgreen:

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by allstar2010 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:41 pm

Hard to believe it’s now 11years since Birr last won it and no real sign of them challenging again. Pity.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by greenairfield » Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:17 pm

All star they drew with K/K and Belmont this year..both teams have ambitions of winning county titles.


So if that's not challenging what is?

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Lone Shark
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Lone Shark » Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:34 pm

greenairfield wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:23 pm
Just to pick up on your comment Lone Shark on alot of the Birr players coming to the latter stage of there careers.

Not taking into account Breeder Mullins as hes a goalie who I might add has been at a different level this year in goals.
(Without doubt the best goalie in the county I think alot of people would say say this even from outside Birr)

The team is not that old...the half back line are all 33 but have dominated most games and on paper are the best half back line in the county.

Then you have Lonergan and Hayden who are also in there 30s ..that leaves nine players in there 20s with the full back line been particularly young.

I wouldn't say it's an old team as you suggested. :mrgreen:
I would say that in terms of teams fighting for senior titles, six starters in their thirties is well above average. Coolderry would probably have something close to that as well, but none of the others would, and at a guess I'd say none of the football clubs would either.

It's all relative of course, but the average age of an intercounty panel is around 24 these days I believe, and I'd be surprised if club was significantly higher than that. I'd guess 25, 26 at most.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

Fairplayalways
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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Fairplayalways » Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:39 pm

I see where Allstar is comming from, ok they drew with KK and Belmont, but I seen them in two games without the players (who were missing) and they were very very poor (no disrespect at all to the young lads who played in them games)..at the games, outside Birr people, most neutrals coulnt name what players Birr were without in them games...admitedly players are back now and appear to be making a huge diffeence, but it does indicate, like alot of other clubs I suppose one could say, that they are thin outside their starting 15...11 years is hard to believe..they were a nice team to follow even if you wernet from Birr, if ya get me drift..everyone could relate to them in someway..they have a tough one against Shinrone, and IF, and its a big IF, they scale that fence, they will be hard beaten by anyone...

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by greenairfield » Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:36 pm

I really do not take much on the the whole 6 starters been over 30..as I said the goalie has hurled at the highest level and still puts out them performances on a weekly basis..so that leaves us with 5 outfield players.

The half back line has dominated young "inter county" players in the last two matches. I know who I would rather on my half back line in a county semifinal a Brian Watkins and Sean Ryan over a Dan Doughan or Mark Egan for example and I assure you that is not me been bias it's me looking at all club matches and judging the way these players perform.

Also just on other clubs age bracket....

Kilkormac/Killoughey - Healion 36? Grogan 33 Leonard 31 kilmartin 31 Gorman 31 Mahon 31

That is 6 outfield starters for K/K..off the top of my head Belmont are in the same boat.

So your point doesn't hold up.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Lone Shark » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:07 pm

(1) - Don't misunderstand me - I'm not saying that these Birr lads are poor players, at all. As you say, it's a superb half back line and one that would be at home in any company. Neither am I saying for a minute that Mullins is a weak link, he absolutely isn't. In a county with a disproportionate number of good goalies, he's definitely up there with the best of them.

Age is not subjective though, it's a matter of fact - and it's also a matter of fact that as you get older, you can be as fit as you like but that touch of acceleration drops off. Maybe, as in the case of someone like Sean Ryan, it goes from excellent to very good, but it still falls down a notch or two. One way or another, my point was not meant disparagingly, it was merely to say that if six players on your starting 15 in their 30s doesn't make you an old team, I've no idea what does. I'd say any more than that rarely if ever happens at senior level.

(2) Fair point on KK - my understanding was that a couple of those are usually subs rather than starters, but there's no question that they are also on the older side as a general rule. Again though, that makes KK old - it doesn't make Birr young! And Belmont absolutely wouldn't be the same - four would be the most that would be consistent starters at 30 or older, and that's including Colin Egan who was in his last year of minor in 2007 so he definitely turns 30 in 2019, but as to whether he's hit that mark or not yet, I couldn't tell you.
Kevin Egan. Signed out of respect for players and all involved with Offaly.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Buttons » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:41 pm

Age is irrelevant, the 2 Mahers and Seamie Callanan are all 30 and will be there again next year.
I remember years ago I think it was Edenderry juniors who had all ex senior players play a real young team, Edenderry would get in positions with balls bouncing over the other team. Would Tullamore have won a county title without Kevin Martin on the edge of the square about 10 years ago, I don’t think so.
I think everyone goes for the underdog so the likes of Shinrone and Belmont would be well supported if they get to a county final.

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Re: Senior A Hurling 2019

Post by Fairplayalways » Mon Sep 16, 2019 8:42 am

not killing the debate at all but one has to factor in too that older players are percieved as wiser players and can make up for a bit of pace with getting in positon as the ball is being struck into them/puck out rather than waiting for the burst of pace, exceptional players maybe I am talking about (say Martin Hanamy Brian Whelehan and now put Sean Ryan and Brian Watkins if you wish into that bracket as current examples)..you will nearly always have 3/4/5/6 (6 at a push) 30 somethings on most club teams..just watch the games on TG4 now over the winter and you will see club games in Clare/Waterford/Limerick/Cork in Munster for example and Wexford/Kilkenny etc. in Leinster and you will see the Clinton Hennessys/James Connors/Niall Gilligans etc. etc. all playing..

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